r/AmItheAsshole • u/Accomplished-Cow7973 • 14h ago
WIBTAH for making a complaint about a coworkers service dog?
Hey everybody. I’m using an old throwaway for this because of the details I need to provide and I’m trying to not cause a big stir at work as it is.
We recently hired someone with a service dog, which is not my complaint. I understand the use of medical aids for disabilities at work, I myself even have an ADA accommodation. I have always been taught to treat service dogs as medical devices, not to distract, touch, or inhibit it from doing its tasks in any way because its purpose is to aid its person.
I have never seen a service dog exhibit the behavior I saw at work. It was whining when not actively being pet, soliciting my coworkers for attention, and begged for food multiple times from people other than its handler. Nobody acknowledged that this was abnormal, and my coworkers were actively petting the dog when it would approach them unsolicited, and the new hire did not discourage this at all. The SD also attempted to wander away from our work station at least twice and jumped into the new hires lap multiple times (it was not alert type of jump, it just wanted to be held and is not a small dog).
I tried to keep an open mind and kept to myself, but I continued to pay attention to the behavior. What set me over the line of thinking about complaining happened when I was eating and speaking to my coworkers, and the SD approached me, placed his head in my lap, and proceeded to beg me for my lunch. When the new hire noticed what it was doing, they yanked on the leash, said “no”and then proceeded to pinch the dog’s ear until it yelped.
I wanted to bring up what tasks the dog performs, since I know that is one of the two legally allowed questions for SDs, but I couldn’t find a way to casually weave it into conversation
If I continue to see this behavior, WIBTAH to make a complaint? I’m not sure what could be done because it is there as part of an ADA accommodation, but the behavior was not conducive for a working environment.
EDIT: As someone with a disability, I do not plan on accusing this person of faking a disability or having a fake service dog. I have a meeting scheduled with a manager in a couple of weeks anyway, have documented the things I have already witnessed, and will bring up the behavior in that meeting unless it gets worse before then.
282
u/NoOrganization98 14h ago
That’s just a dog by the sound of it.
138
u/dsk 14h ago
Yes .. an untrained dog.
36
u/StructEngineer91 Partassipant [1] 14h ago
They probably have it "registered" somewhere (that is a scam) as an ESA and either don't realize, or more likely don't care, that an ESA is different than a service animal.
15
u/username__0000 Partassipant [1] 9h ago
And an abusive owner. That ear pinch pissed me off. I would have said something.
1
u/FunQuantity6074 1h ago
True. Nobody is questioning the person's disability, but the dog's behavior at work is still a valid concern.
1.3k
u/johjo_has_opinions Asshole Enthusiast [9] 14h ago
NTA the way that people can just say “it’s a service dog” and bring their pet anywhere is infuriating to me. Actual service dogs do not behave like this.
432
u/wolfcaroling Asshole Aficionado [16] 14h ago
This. I have worked with trained service dogd and they lie down and sleep under desks until they are needed.
100
u/ljharris 14h ago
This was my experience as well.
51
u/wolfcaroling Asshole Aficionado [16] 14h ago
Thing is, I am in Canada. And in BC, where we have provincial certification for owner-trained service dogs. If OP is in the US, where there are no rules about how well trained a service dog has to be, they are SOL.
107
u/Marquar234 14h ago
The ADA rules specify that a service animal must be housebroken and under the individual's control at all times or the individual must be able to take effective control of it. And when it is an employee, they do not have an automatic right to have a service animal like they would if they were a customer at a bank, restaurant, hotel, etc. Instead, the animal would be considered a "reasonable accommodation" for the individual.
51
u/wolfcaroling Asshole Aficionado [16] 13h ago
So it sounds like OP had the right to request that the dog be kept on a leash at least. But everyone hates the person who isn't cool with the dog, even when the dog is being an asshole.
-1
u/scoschooo 8h ago
OP has no right to anything. OP didn't hire this person and isn't a manager above them. This is just a coworker. OP is clueless when they say "I can ask X which is allowed". That isn't what the law is about. That is for interviews and hiring.
OP can do what they want with a coworker, but should just talk to HR or management about any problems they have.
19
u/harrellj 12h ago
And just to clarify, the service animal as a reasonable accommodation was the subject of a lawsuit that just had a verdict delivered yesterday. Of course, in that case it was for a diabetic alert dog and the company was claiming that the employee could do things like a CGM or insulin pump or more frequent breaks to check their sugar.
21
u/Marquar234 12h ago
First, let's appreciate the irony that this was a company that provides training to HR professionals on workplace matters.
Second, it seems like part of the reason for the loss is that they did not explain why a service dog was not reasonable for an office worker. If it had been for a zookeeper position, then I could see a dog not being reasonable.
•
u/iHave1Pookie 33m ago
A workplace is usually not a public space. Completely different set of rules.
19
u/sable1970 Partassipant [1] 11h ago
The ADA does not require service animals be certified or trained, which is really stupid and why we're seeing so many issues with esa's.
23
u/OtterAnarchist Partassipant [1] 11h ago
It actually does require them to be trained but it does not specify beyond the required results of the training i.e. a dog must behave within certain parameters but they do not need to be trained in a specific manner or by anyone in particular, nor does the handler need to have documentation/certification of the training; however if a dog is accused of being ill behaved and a lawsuit results then a handler will likely need to produce such documentation in order to legally prove the training and obedience of their animal.
3
u/couldbemage 7h ago
It's not a requirement in practice if there's no way to check or verify other than a lawsuit that can only happen if there are damages.
That would be like if there were no penalties for driving without insurance unless you hit someone.
13
u/OpportunityFit2810 7h ago
An emotional support animal is not granted the same accommodations as a service animals
2
u/couldbemage 7h ago
Unless someone says it's a service animal.
There's no legal way to distinguish other than the owner admitting it.
3
8
u/QueerGeologist Partassipant [3] 7h ago
there's no official training program in the USA, but the dog (or miniature horse) must be under control of the handler, be housebroken, and if they're disruptive (dog barks at everything or the horse spooks) they can be told to leave. or they can be not allowed in certain areas, zoos often restrict where a service animal is allowed to go or how long they can stay there. for example at the zoo where I live service animals aren't allowed in the farm animal barn area, the aviary, animal encounters, and one of the tiger viewing areas. if I had to guess the first 3 are to keep them from scaring the zoo animals, and the tigers is probably bc the tigers will try and hunt the service animal.
1
66
u/BlackChimaera 13h ago
I've been to cons with thousands of attendees and nobody knew there was a service dog under one of the vendors' tables until the dog poked its head out. Turns out there were actually two dogs, the man's service dog and another one he was training. Even the in training dog was better behaved than the dog in this post.
17
u/wolfcaroling Asshole Aficionado [16] 13h ago
Right? I meet lots of in training dogs for PADS or Heeling Assistants and even when they are excited their handler controls them.
11
u/Argufier 12h ago
Hell, I bring my pet to work occasionally (my office is dog friendly) and she sleeps under the desk until I take her out. I certainly don't allow her to bother other people or beg. My coworkers can come visit for scritches if they want to, but she's not wandering around free.
4
u/wolfcaroling Asshole Aficionado [16] 12h ago
Right? This is not about disability, it's about basic dog ownership.
114
u/TogarSucks Asshole Aficionado [16] 14h ago edited 14h ago
I absolutely HATE when people claim their pets as service animals. It’s ableist, creates problems for actual service animals, and is unsanitary.
I say this as someone who loves dogs and whose day is brightened whenever I get to encounter one. Pets don’t belong everywhere.
NTA.
49
u/SherbetDue789 Partassipant [1] 14h ago
Yup. I’ve seen way too many “service dogs” pee on the floor while their owners just stood there. Not to mention, there have been actual service dogs who were attacked by untrained “service dogs,” which can take them out of commission.
5
u/ArthurIngersoll 7h ago
I saw a trained service dog at the airport recently (with a visually impaired person) and it was amazing. That pup was laser focused on his job. I don't think I could have distracted him if I wanted to. I roll my eyes at nonsense like this.
1
u/Practical_Winner_739 5h ago
Agreed. Seeing an actual Service Dog at work is truely a sight to see. They have a duty to their person and they are unwavering in it.
14
u/karenskael Partassipant [1] 13h ago
Agreed. Fuck ESAs, they've made actual service dogs look bad.
1
u/QueerBooplesnoot 5h ago
The problem isn't ESAs, it's people not understanding what an ESA is and what they are allowed to do. An ESA is just a pet that gives you emotional support and the only rights you have when it comes to ESAs are in regards to housing. They are not expections to no pet rules in public and far too many people don't realize that
2
u/kinkerbelle666 3h ago
Be mad at the employees and the corporations who are shy of lawsuits then tell their employees to do nothing if they want to keep their jobs.. .
The ADA builds in the ability for real legitimate service dogs to be asked to leave if they're acting like this. Being a service dog does not exempt the dog from the requirements of the ADA (safe, under control, non-aggressive, healthy, groomed).
The reason service dogs don't get asked to leave is because one of the heads of Walmart etc would prefer for you and a staff member and God knows who else to be at risk or inconvenienced just so they can avoid a suit that either 1. Would be thrown out if their employees were properly educated and did everything right or 2. Would result in a payout that they can very easily afford.
251
u/fomaaaaa Asshole Aficionado [15] 14h ago
NTA. Make the complaint. That’s not a trained service dog. That’s just a dog someone wanted to bring to work
17
u/rnick468 14h ago
HR probably doesn't vet the certification for service dogs, they probably just rubber stamp the application to avoid inquiries by the ADA if they refuse.
OP should complain to HR that this particular dog is not a certified "service animal" and the new hire should be required to provide certification.
102
u/Yehrmahm 14h ago
There is no “certification” for service animals. Various organizations will endorse trainers or training programs but there is no regulatory agency or oversight.
What OP can do (NTA btw) is write to HR saying that the dog is causing a disruption and you would like them to verify which services the dog is trained to perform, because you don’t want to complain if the dog has been trained to beg and seek attention from others as a service to support the coworker’s disability.
5
u/ArthurIngersoll 7h ago
I love how there's responses below you that are calm and normal, when you just dropped a BOMB! I'm gonna laugh at your response all day.
2
33
u/Marquar234 14h ago
There is no certification requirement for a service animal and the employer should not ask for such. What they should do is inform the person with the dog that they do not consider the dog to be under control and as such, it is not a reasonable accommodation.
Edit: It might be a good idea for the employer to provide a list of alternative reasonable accommodations based on what disability the employee has.
21
u/rebelangel 13h ago
Yeah all OP has to say is that the dog’s behavior is disrupting their ability to perform their work. OP mentioned the ADA, so I’m assuming they’re in the US, which means there is no certification here.
6
u/LoveAliens_Predators 14h ago
There is no “certification”
18
u/therealladysparky Partassipant [1] 14h ago
I'd like to amend your comment with there is not a certification IN THE US. Other countries do have them.
5
u/Killingtime_4 10h ago
But this discussion has been centered around the ADA- the Americans with Disability Act- so the US is the context that matters
1
u/musthavesoundeffects 10h ago
There is no “The ADA” to do an inquiry. Just lawsuits.
2
u/ParsnipFarmer676 5h ago
There actually are ADA compliance "officers," who conduct investigations (usually anonymously) to ensure compliance at public agencies and/or privately-owned establishments that have received complaints.
I work at a public agency, and we've had a few visits from them over the years. They don't file lawsuits when you're found to have violations, they only send you a list of those + how to fix them. For example, we had to remove the keyboard trays from our public computers, as someone in a wheelchair was unable to fit under the desk because of those.
125
55
u/1962Michael Commander in Cheeks [272] 14h ago
NTA.
The animal certainly should not be encroaching on anyone else's space.
There is a huge difference between a service dog and an emotional support animal. Even if the accommodation is for an emotional support dog, it needs to be a trained animal and not just "bring your pet to work."
If you can't work the question into casual conversation with the new hire, you should feel free to ask your manager or HR.
1
u/MsCattatude 5h ago
ESA in the USA is only for housing. For work it has to be a service dog or service mini horse.
91
u/Glittering_Water_245 14h ago
So your new hire abuses her service dog, great…
107
u/dealbreakerstalkshow Partassipant [4] 14h ago
New hire abuses her dog. There’s no way this is a service dog.
25
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 14h ago
I also wanted to give more info, I looked into the new hire’s background and they are apparently a dog trainer on the side which baffled me more.
8
u/Zosmie 14h ago
Based on what happened to Madeleine whites dog recently, there's no education nor regulation for that. I think you should talk with hr/boss about this situation, she's obviously lying and manipulating the law for disabilities.
6
u/YoshiKoshi 7h ago
Anyone can call themselves a dog trainer. But there are voluntary certifications. Some of them issue the "certification" as soon as the check clears. Others are legitimate organizations that require applicants to pass exams to receive their certification.
As a long-time rescue volunteer, I've seen the results of bad trainers and it's not pretty.
7
58
u/Deep-Manner-4111 Asshole Aficionado [19] 14h ago edited 14h ago
NTA... But tread very lightly with this. While I 100% agree that a real, trained service dog does not behave in this way, speaking out against this could cause major problems for you. You don't know how people are going to respond to that accusation. You could be labeled a bigot, or even lose your job if someone decides that you are being descrimanatory. It could turn everyone against you if this goes wrong.
You're not wrong, but think really hard about if it's worth it.
16
u/Barrot_and_Rubys_Mom 14h ago
Sadly, this is true. Companies will do anything to avoid a lawsuit. I would try to send an anonymous complaint to HR
24
u/Yehrmahm 14h ago
I’d talk to HR about the very real possibility of a lawsuit from an employee who gets bitten or is even just tripped up by the dog being where it shouldn’t be.
10
u/Barrot_and_Rubys_Mom 14h ago
Yes! An untrained dog in the office could also be dangerous. You are correct that this should be included in any complaint, anonymous or not.
6
u/rebelangel 13h ago
HR could have a bigger problem, though, if people are complaining that the dog’s behavior is negatively impacting their ability to do their work. If the dog is constantly bothering people, you could make an argument that it’s harassment. Or, if someone is afraid of dogs, they could claim it’s a hostile work environment because the dog’s presence is causing them anxiety.
9
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 12h ago
We have a coworker that is afraid of dogs and will isolate herself and not enter the department until shift change is over and the SD has left.
11
u/Dull_Double1531 11h ago
Wild that that person's needs can't be accommodated because this person is pretending they need their doggie with them at work (we're assuming)
→ More replies (1)3
u/Deep-Manner-4111 Asshole Aficionado [19] 13h ago
That is true! They mentioned that others were actively petting the dog, so it seemed like maybe OP was alone in being bothered. But, obviously we don't have all the facts. OP would have a better idea of the overall vibe and if anyone else seems to be upset. If that's the case, I'd definitely recommend approaching this as a group. It makes the odds of something being done about it much higher and removes some of the backlash risk.
Just for clarification I'm not saying that OP should NOT say anything, I just wanted to make sure they gave it some real consideration and weighed all the pros, cons, and possible outcomes this could have. That's all.
3
u/rebelangel 12h ago
People getting distracted by petting the dog is a disruption too.
2
u/Deep-Manner-4111 Asshole Aficionado [19] 11h ago
Well that's on those individuals. And they will be the ones that face any repercussions if they aren't getting their work done.
A workplace cannot legally tell someone to remove their service animal if they need it. Obviously that's not the case here, but to remove this dog, the company is basically going to have to say that the person is lying about it. Most companies will never have the balls to do that, because for some reason if this person ever does have a medical emergency at work and they made them get rid of the dog, they can be sued big time.
1
u/sable1970 Partassipant [1] 11h ago
While that's absolutely true, you cannot remove the dog for that. The ADA has guidelines for what constitutes disruptive service animal behavior and unfortunately none of the described behaviors fit those guidelines. That means its up to management to ensure the disruptions are kept to a minimum.....this is if in the US.
1
u/GeekySkittle 10h ago
The ADA has guidelines but they don’t necessarily apply in this case since it’s someone who works there not a customer. The part that HR should be focused on is if the service dog is a reasonable accommodation. A service dog is typically considered a reasonable accommodation so long as the industry isn’t food, health, or lab related. If having the dog there is preventing work from being done then it’s may no longer be considered a reasonable accommodation. While it’s rare, I have known handlers who were no longer allowed to bring their service dog to their workplace due to the dog behaving inappropriately in the same way as OP’s coworker’s dog (soliciting attention).
1
u/ParsnipFarmer676 5h ago
Since they used the term "ADA," we can safely assume it's the US - that acronym stands for Americans with Disabilities Act."
4
u/Next-Statement5457 14h ago
That’s unfortunate that genuine concerns and people are being silenced due to fear of being labeled a bigot nowadays
-6
14h ago
[deleted]
→ More replies (3)2
u/SimpleAstronomer7854 11h ago
Idk why people are down voting this. This happens people! Ridiculous or not it's the truth of today's world.
I knew someone that got fired from their job became they referred to A FICTIONAL CHARACTER on a TV show as "heavyset." Companies will do anything to make sure they look like they don't descriminate.
0
u/simplyirresponsible Partassipant [1] 13h ago
But the dog is a huge distraction which means it is NOT a service dog. If it were, it would stay by it's master's side and wait until it was needed. That's how they're trained.
This dog is walking around, looking for pets and attention and then bothering people when they're having their lunch.
She may as well be bringing her child to work everyday.
2
u/SimpleAstronomer7854 11h ago
I don't think I've seen a single soul argue that this dog is a legitimate service dog. But for the company to take a solid stance and suggest that the person with the dog is lying is a complicated process, with a lot of red tape that just probably isn't going to happen. More likely that it might backfire on OP.
18
u/Dustytails123 14h ago
YWNBTA. That’s not a service dog. For starters, the dog needs to be leashed or tethered at all times (unless its task requires being offleash, which very few do), and under control at all times. So the wandering breaks that, as does the begging for food (clearly its not under control if the owner reacts by yanking on it and hurting it).
The animal also shouldn’t be barking or whining, this is disruptive and can allow the dog to be asked to leave.
The person can be asked to remove the animal if it is out of control (which it seems to be if it’s wandering around and trying to get food).
Also, emotional support is not the same as a trained service animal; if they cannot identify a task outside of comforting them, it is a emotional support animal, and ESAs do not have public access rights.
I would take this up with a supervisor, as this can get very tricky. I have had a similar situation at school, a ‘service dog in training’ was repeatedly barking during lectures and was eventually asked to drop the class or leave the dog at home.
10
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 14h ago
Thank you for the insight with your situation with something similar! As far as I know we do not allow ESAs into the building, only SDs. The dog has a security badge from our building, so I know they went through HR with it, but I’m not sure what information had to be provided. And when the dog wandered, it was on a loosely held leash.
I’m worried about being seen as the office witch for making a complaint about a dog everyone seems to like (including my manager, who experienced the begging first hand) and it getting removed.
7
u/GeekySkittle 10h ago edited 10h ago
Post this in one of the service dog subs. There are a few lawyers over there who can help give you key terms to mention to HR. While they likely won’t remove the dog, they should talk to the handler about not letting the dog wander and solicit pets/food.
Some things you can do now:
- talk to your manager or the handler and frame it as concern that the dog will eat something it shouldn’t.
- when the dog approaches you for food ask the handler to recall their dog because what you’re eating isn’t dog safe
- talk to your manager/the handler about the distraction and commotion caused by everyone petting the dog. Maybe suggest that there be designated times where the dog can say hi to people to prevent everyone crowding that desk area.
3
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 10h ago
I forgot to mention it in the main post, but it did eat something off of the floor under a desk and nobody is sure what it was
12
u/Anonymous_Sad_Person Colo-rectal Surgeon [33] 14h ago edited 14h ago
NTA - service dogs are supposed to be trained better than this.
She is responsible for her dogs training and overall behavior. She is failing herself, her dog, and everyone she works with by not training her dog better. Not to mention how bad she's making service dogs look, things like this are why a lot of people don't take them seriously.
Hopefully she's just slacking off in his training and not just lying all together about him being service dog.
7
u/Agreeable_Dark6408 14h ago
Can you mail an anonymous typed letter to HR telling them what is going on in the office with this dog? It’s obviously not working. Service dogs work by paying attention to only their owner. Not this one.
Tell HR that you are sending this anonymously because you don’t want the owner told that it is you complaining.
4
8
7
u/dealbreakerstalkshow Partassipant [4] 14h ago
Idk if there’s any good way to bring this up yourself. I’d be likely to just allow things to continue and hopefully new hire’s dog noticeably embarrasses them. Let people make fools of themselves.
I work with people who use service dogs (seeing eye dogs). Most new people don’t even notice the dog is there at first and that’s how it should be. If you can tell a dog is there, outside of emergency, it’s not behaving as a service dog.
6
u/Helpful_Leather8917 14h ago
Umm tell someone please this person is doing dog abuse. Pinching its ear till it yelped and yanking on its leash?? Not okay. Please tell someone about this. Any pet group or your boss.
6
u/ArtfulAlice 14h ago
Federal criteria for a service dog under the Americans with Disabilities Act requires that the dog must remain under the handler's control at all times while in a public space. When you make your complaint, state that specifically.
4
u/Dylan_TheDon 14h ago
nope, make that complaint, people like that give actual service dogs a bad look
5
u/Front_Help_310 14h ago
that is not a service dog, obsiously, so report to the HR
untrained and not disciplined dogs are risky at a workplace
6
u/alittlepizza 14h ago
The behavior is off for a dog that lives with a dog trainer who should understand the expectations of a service dog in public. They're not supposed to act like that and moist service dogs know very well the difference between when they're working and not working and can just be a dog.
The behaviour implies this is not a thoroughly or professionally trained service animal. The rules allow self training and demand no certification for good reasons. The cost of a pre-trained service animal with all the bells and whistles is really high and puts them out of reach for some people that need them. It also leads to situations like the one you're in.
You've read the questions that you can ask and you wouldnt be out of line for asking. I would have gotten angry and upset seeing them get yanked and an ear punch, that's just mean and gives an idea of why you don't want to talk to them.
3
u/Turbulent_Cow2355 Partassipant [3] 14h ago
NTA
It's not a service dog. People pay tens of thousands of dollars for a service dog. They are well trained. A service dog that does any of the above has either never been trained or lost all of its training. My guess is that this is not a real service dog and that your coworker is a liar.
1
u/Glass_Animator8854 10h ago
It could very well be an owner-trained (very poorly trained) service dog. They do not cost thousands of dollars which is why they are allowed to—most people with disabilities can’t afford a professionally trained service dog and there can be long waiting lists as well. If the dog is poorly trained but still does the designated task, it could be a service dog. However it does fall on the handler to manage the dog at all times. Sounds like this dog needs a short tether.
3
u/TheRoadkillRapunzel Partassipant [3] 14h ago
NTA. This is not a service dog.
Go to HR and ask for an accommodation to be free from the distractions and disruptions of a dog that whines, begs and jumps on people.
They might take care of it for you if you can get enough other people to ask for the same thing.
2
2
2
u/justmommingmywaythru Partassipant [1] 14h ago
NTA. This definitely needs to be addressed asap- by HR.
Start documenting the specific instances of the ‘service dog’ being disruptive and obviously untrained with dates and times. Then set up a meeting with HR and your supervisor. The key is to focus solely on Fido’s behavior and the effect it is having in the workplace- stick to objective facts. Do not speculate on the new hire’s disability or the SD’s training (or lack thereof). I’d especially highlight that you understand and support reasonable accommodations- especially with your personal experience- but this “service animal” is significantly disrupting your ability to do your job safely and effectively.
Employers have a lot more wiggle room than a general business you visit as a customer when it comes to providing reasonable accommodations. Employers can legally ask an employee for documentation or a demonstration ensuring the animal is trained to handle a professional work environment without disruption. Directly from the ADA: “If an animal is verified to be out of control and the handler does not take effective action to correct it, management has the right to legally remove or bar the animal from the premises. However, they must still allow the employee to work via other accommodations.” That being said, some employers don’t know enough about the ADA or their rights to adequately address this type of issue, but that is on them, not you. I think the fear of saying or doing the wrong thing often allows this type of situation to persist far too long.
2
2
u/tacticall0tion 14h ago
NTA. That is not a service dog. That is someone using the service animal rules to bring their poorly trained pet to work. As for the ear pinch I'd have done it to them and made an example of it... that's disgusting behaviour
2
u/OneQueerRuffian 12h ago
NTA. The ADA does not protect dogs that behave like this, whether it's a real service dog or not. "On duty" dogs should be under control of their handler at all times, and should not create a significant distraction. Also the ear pinching is genuinely concerning
2
u/Specialist-Note-4074 14h ago
Sometimes you give people the rope and let them do the rest, and this is one of those situations. If it’s as bad as you describe, it will not doubt come to a head at some point in the near future. I don’t see what you get by calling it out before everyone else sees it for themselves.
This reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where George pretended to be disabled…
1
u/AutoModerator 14h ago
AUTOMOD Thanks for posting! READ THIS COMMENT - MAKE SURE TO CHECK ALL YOUR DMS. This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything.
Hey everybody. I’m using an old throwaway for this because of the details I need to provide and I’m trying to not cause a big stir at work as it is.
We recently hired someone with a service dog, which is not my complaint. I understand the use of medical aids for disabilities at work, I myself even have an ADA accommodation. I have always been taught to treat service dogs as medical devices, not to distract, touch, or inhibit it from doing its tasks in any way because its purpose is to aid its person.
I have never seen a service dog exhibit the behavior I saw at work. It was whining when not actively being pet, soliciting my coworkers for attention, and begged for food multiple times from people other than its handler. Nobody acknowledged that this was abnormal, and my coworkers were actively petting the dog when it would approach them unsolicited, and the new hire did not discourage this at all. The SD also attempted to wander away from our work station at least twice and jumped into the new hires lap multiple times (it was not alert type of jump, it just wanted to be held and is not a small dog).
I tried to keep an open mind and kept to myself, but I continued to pay attention to the behavior. What set me over the line of thinking about complaining happened when I was eating and speaking to my coworkers, and the SD approached me, placed his head in my lap, and proceeded to beg me for my lunch. When the new hire noticed what it was doing, they yanked on the leash, said “no”and then proceeded to pinch the dog’s ear until it yelped.
I wanted to bring up what tasks the dog performs, since I know that is one of the two legally allowed questions for SDs, but I couldn’t find a way to casually weave it into conversation
If I continue to see this behavior, WIBTAH to make a complaint? I’m not sure what could be done because it is there as part of an ADA accommodation, but the behavior was not conducive for a working environment.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
1
u/dsk 14h ago edited 14h ago
NTA It sounds like this is an 'emotional support animal '- which have no standard requirements for training or specific function and are not recognized under ADA. That designation tends to be abused as well. This is not a properly trained service dog. It's fair to complain about their behavior.
But even if it was a proper service dog - the behaviour is disruptive and unacceptable in a workplace. Many people have genuine fear of dogs, allergies, or even a religious objection to dogs, and they have a right to not be unduly burdened by an untrained animal that invades their space.
1
u/sadlaptopgamer 14h ago
YWNBTAH !! i know everyone's commented on how this dog is definitely not trained (which i agree with) but i just want to say pinching the dogs ears is so cruel too wtf :( this is weird behavior all around and i really would consider making a complaint if i was you!!!
1
u/Pandappuccino 14h ago
NTA. That's not a service dog. That's someone's pet who they're claiming is a service dog so they can bring it in. A properly-trained service dog wouldn't exhibit any behaviors like that (ESPECIALLY leaving their handler!!!) while working.
1
1
u/Psych0matt 14h ago
I mean, I’d love to have a dog at work I could pet, however that’s not a service dog and I would definitely put in a complaint after the first few weeks!
(Jk mostly, NTA, that is 100% not a service dog and should not be there)
1
u/aftermarrow 14h ago
NTA. not a service dog and i wish the usa was stricter on the definition of ‘service dog’ so we didn’t have to deal with these fakes all the time.
but they’re also abusing the dog. pinching the ear until it yelps is horrible.
1
u/Mental-Button-1159 14h ago
Look up the guidelines and behavior expectations of Service animals before you make your complaint. Either print these out or email them to HR for your complaint so you have proof that this is an actual legal issue. Remember HR is there to protect the company so your complaint will only be taken seriously if your have legal facts to justify it
1
u/Anxious-Hyena6173 14h ago
No way that is a service dog, sounds more emotional support from an online website!
1
u/Liv-Julia 14h ago
NTA
It's simply not a service dog. SDs don't act like that. I'd put it in HR's lap.
1
1
u/goodnsimple Partassipant [2] 14h ago
I get why we have in the past not had certification and paperwork for service dogs… but just like other things people abuse the privilege and now we can’t have nice things.
I do think there should be a certification and we need to start being able to ask for it. Like a drivers license. Not what the disability is but the program the dog has graduated from.
Even a self trained support animal should have to pass a test. And get a certificate. And surely we can make something not easily forged?!
Fake service dogs lead to discrimination against real service dogs and it is so frustrating!
1
1
u/DynkoFromTheNorth Asshole Aficionado [16] 14h ago
No way in Hell is that a trained dog. NTA. Does it even wear a harness?
1
u/Crzy_Grl Asshole Enthusiast [5] 14h ago
NTA i am in the USA. We've had service dogs at the factory where i work. The ones i knew most belonged to a blind guy who also married into a family we are neighbors with. The first one i remember was a very good service dog. That one got old and was retired, then he got another one. The 2nd one was not as good, but nothing like the dog you are describing. It made a couple of errors, and was sent back for more training.
1
u/Cheska1234 14h ago
NTA and she sucks for doing that to her puppers. Report this. She makes everything harder for everyone with legitimate service dogs.
1
u/rebelangel 13h ago
That’s not a service dog. A service dog needs to be under the control of the handler at all times. I would report to HR how the dog’s behavior is disrupting your work. A service dog can be removed if it is causing a disruption to business operations.
1
u/Crafty_Original_7349 Partassipant [1] 13h ago
That’s a fake service dog. A properly trained dog will not behave like this. Take it to HR and let them deal with it. NTA
1
u/hotwheels2886 13h ago
Nta as someone who is disabled this behavior is unfair and annoying. They probably registered a "service dogs" website for fee. This behavior is not normal sd behavior. This is my dog behavior and he is not a service dog. I love him but he belongs home unless dog friendly place
1
1
u/desertrock62 13h ago
NTA. However, be prepared for anything you do or say against an ADA accommodation to be held against you.
1
u/TheRamazon 13h ago
NTA. We need a service dog registry. Properly trained dogs serving legit disabilities should be issued an ID card that businesses should be allowed to request as proof it is legit. If doctors can issue handicap parking placards, surely we can figure this out. The abuse is insane.
1
1
1
u/CodenameZoya 13h ago
Is it an emotional support dog rather than a Service dog? I think any dog can be considered an emotional support dog, but I think a Service dog has to have certain Training.
1
u/Time_Zombie_4431 12h ago
NTA, not only is the dog 200% not a service dog shes actively abusing it at work.
You should absolutely make a complaint about the fact that it isn’t a service dog and that she actively abuses it at work.
What an awful person.
1
u/Lopsided_Ad2082 12h ago
Nya. This isn't a service dog as they are properly trained. I would bring it up with manage
1
u/Shanna_B2020 12h ago
No, you absolutely wouldn't. I work a service dog and trained guide dogs for several years. The behaviors you're describing are completely unacceptable and potentially a safety concern. Everything about this is a problem, and I'm sorry you have to put up with it.
If my service dog behaved like this at work, I would be absolutely mortified. But then, he would never because I wouldn't tolerate it.
1
u/PomegranateOk6767 Asshole Enthusiast [5] 11h ago
Report everything, to your employer and animal protection. What a gross person. NTA.
1
u/houseofdragonfan 11h ago
That is not a service dog—It’s either someone with an ESA lumping it into the same category as a service dog (which it’s not), or they are just straight up lying. I hate people who pull this shit and make others suspicious of legitimate service dogs. I have an ESA and am so grateful for the legal protections I get in regard to housing access, but I’d never do something like this. Yuck.
1
1
u/leovinuss 11h ago
Huge NTA
That's pretty clearly not a service dog, but if it is you need to have HR tell everyone what service it performs. The reason you're allowed to ask is so you can help in case of emergency.
1
1
u/Accurate-Farm-2878 10h ago
That’s not a service dog. Trained service dogs do not behave like that.
1
1
u/SVAuspicious 10h ago
Real service dog or "emotional support animal" aka pet?
NTA. Just as bad as bringing a child to work.
1
u/mind_the_umlaut Partassipant [2] 10h ago
That's not a service dog, and is not covered by the ADA policies. What can you do about it? Can HR ask the owner to prove that it is a service animal? They can ask, what is the animal trained to do, and is the animal required because of a disability.
1
u/Fuzzzer777 Partassipant [1] 9h ago
This is a slippery slope. You you can't say its NOT a service dog, because dogs are dogs and she is allowed to have a service dog. However, if the dog is displaying behavior that is unacceptable as a service animal, the dog may need to be retrained to not do these things.
The handler should be in control of the SD at ALL times. If the dogbis approaching other people, thus is not happening.
Do a little research on the ADA sight regarding proper Service Animal behavior and print out some documents to take to the manager. No one can DENY the Animal access, but the manager can certainly recommend the handler get the animal under control. Begging, whining, approaching, and certainly jumping up on other people is not allowed as a service dog. The handler needs to correct these behaviors.
And the manager needs to learn, be cautious to use the exact verbiage when talking to this employee.
1
u/Low-Deer-3565 8h ago
I would be more concerned about the animal abuse YTA for not focusing on that
1
u/Floating-Cynic Asshole Aficionado [11] 8h ago
I have a different angle than what has already been mentioned here and I think could help you.
I dated a guy in college who was legally blind and had a guide dog- since he was really new to making friends in "mainstream" areas, he let everyone pet his dog. This ended up creating a really bad situation where the dog quit alerting him to curbs and intersections and he got injured. He learned the hard way why it can be a big deal, he actually got hurt, and everyone lost his friendship because he was so angry about it.
Realistically- if someone's medical equipment were malfunctioning and you knew, you would be concerned about their safety. It's important to address this, not only because it's distracting, but also because if the dog was somehow untrained by other coworkers, now this person could be in danger because the dog isn't paying attention.
NTA, either the dog isn't a service animal and shouldn't be there, or it is, and your coworker's safety is at risk. Either way, the dog's behavior is a distraction.
1
u/ChangeOfPlan1807 8h ago
they yanked on the leash, said “no”and then proceeded to pinch the dog’s ear until it yelped.
I think you should report them to the ASPCA. This is unconscionable.
1
u/jjrobinson73 Asshole Aficionado [10] 8h ago
NTA
I get service dogs provide a need, but people are taking it to the extreme by making ANY dog an ESA, and using that interchangeably with a service dog.
*Putting on HR hat\* - Which I put this in there because yes, sometimes our hands are tied for ADA, etc, but employers can ask, because the rules for employers are different than the rules for the general public. Title 1 governs employment and does not use the same strict guidelines. Having SD/ESA falls under the ADA too and employers can say this is unreasonable and causes an undue burden on them (productivity if they dog constantly needs to be petted.) All of this can be found with a Google Search.
Bring it up to HR, and explain like you have in this post what you have seen as far as behaviors, begging, distracting co-workers, etc.
*Taking off my HR Hat\*
Now, my personal opinion: People like your co-worker piss me off. They bring untrained dogs out in public and call them service dogs and those dogs go on to bite people, etc. It's this type of action that gives real service dogs a bad name. And, I 100% REAL service dogs. I also support ESA's if used correctly and they have been trained.
1
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 6h ago
I thought ESA’s only granted housing protections, but that is good to know! Thank you for the HR input, I tried googling but couldn’t find much that addressed a working environment well. I’m going to escalate to my manager first about the behavior and if thing do not improve I can see HR getting involved.
1
u/lambeyoncealways 6h ago
Please report, because when someone with an actual service dog needs to bring theirs to work with them, this dog will be a huge distraction for them.
1
u/SufficientOpening218 6h ago
Thats not a service dog, thats a pet that has been pressed into service.
When i ate in restaurants, my service dog qas so quiet and still under the table, the waiters usually were surprised i had a dog with me when i got up to leave.
I once had an entire physicsl therapy appointment, 45 min, and the PT didnt see the dog on his down stay behind the cabinet that jutted out a bit. Then when he started snoring, ( i had released him from duty), she looked around and said "do you here snoring?"
1
u/augspies 6h ago
Service dogs require tons of training, and training needs to be reinforced weekly, monthly. And for at least some of them that requires them to spend 1-2 weeks every 2-3 years revisiting that training on a daily basis, possibly by returning to the training facility or a like one and spending that time daily reinvestijg in training. It's no small task, and this is why I don't have one. I cannot commit to that. So, it could absolutely be a service dog who's owner just doesn't have capacity or desire to do the proper training.
1
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 6h ago
Apparently they train dogs and take the SD to compete in breed specific shows frequently.
1
u/Dry_Director_5320 6h ago
This is absolutely unacceptable behavior for a service animal and should be called out! It makes those of us who have real service animals who we put the time, resources, and constant effort into training have a much harder time with access.
1
u/Ancient-Sun-1080 6h ago
NTA. Your co worker defo is though lying about having a service dog. It makes those with legit needs look bad.
1
u/Buckleupbuttercup77 Asshole Aficionado [10] 6h ago
NTA. This is no more a service dog than my Betty Jolene who is curled up on the sofa beside as I write this.
She’s lying. There is no way in hell that a person with a service dog would anllow this behavior. It’s an pet.
And, what she is doing is what makes it so difficult for people to acknowledge and treat service dogs correctly.
Report her. Tell them it makes you uncomfortable having the dog whining and wondering around teh office.
1
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 6h ago
Betty Jolene is a great dog name! I love people names for animals. I don’t want to accuse her of lying, because I would never want someone to accuse me of lying about my disability, I just want the behavior to be addressed.
1
u/Buckleupbuttercup77 Asshole Aficionado [10] 2h ago
You do not need to accuse her. Just say the dog is causing disruptions in the workplace and it needs to be addressed.
Betty Jolene is a Treeing Walker Coonhound. So, a southern girl (USA) and nothing’s more southern than Jolene. She’s a rescue who hates all loud sounds so was left on her own to starve. Picked up by a rescue and I adopted her. Just happened to be a purebred (I do not care about that).
Craziest, quirkiest, and sweetest dog ever. And she talks as much as (if not more than) a husky. I think hounds actually taught the huskies how to talk 😉.
1
u/Narrow_Possession348 5h ago
You would be the AH for NOT reporting this to AH. This is NOT a service dog. Let me guess, the handler is a Gen Z girl? Complain every day. She should be fired for this stunt.
1
u/One_Bluebird5459 5h ago
NTA anyone can something is a service animal and your coworker probably just lied about this dog being a service animal to bring their dog to work let’s be for real here. I see people with chihuahua’s around my school saying they’re a service animal. It’s total bs and definitely needs to have some stricter regulations and proof of training.
1
u/lbethsalander 5h ago
I don’t see anyone commenting about the fact that she pinched the dog’s ear until it yelped. I wouldn’t be approaching management over the dog being there, but I would be filing a complaint with OP’s local animal welfare agency. If she pinches the dog until it yelps in front of an office full of people, what the hell does she do to it at home?
1
u/L1ttle_Behemoth 5h ago
That is NOT a service dog, idgaf what the new hire says. That is an untrained pet, and you are NTA for making a complaint.
1
u/MirandaPierpont 4h ago
She abused the dog in your presence, and enouraging it to behave inappropriately for the setting is also abuse. You're TA if you DON'T report.
1
1
u/miann77 Partassipant [1] 3h ago
Is it wearing a vest with an organization’s name? If so, I’d contact them and explain your concerns. I raise service dog puppies and my organization would absolutely want to work with the person to evaluate the dog, and retrain/better train both of them (Some handlers get lazy and don’t enforce rules and commands, and dogs are masters of taking advantage of lazy handlers!)
I’d also contact HR as the dog is exhibiting troubling behaviors that interfere with your work. They can ask the person what two tasks it is trained to do. Also, pinching the dog’s ear is an old-fashioned technique that does nothing except confuse the dog and cause it pain.
Good luck and keep us posted.
2
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 3h ago
It does not, it’s a regular “service dog | do not distract” vest. The new hire is apparently also a dog trainer on the side who shows this dog at breed specific competitions, so I don’t understand what is going on in this situation.
1
u/PinkPandaHumor 1h ago
Doesn't sound like a real service dog. She sounds mean to pinch the dog’s ear until it yelped.
•
u/iHave1Pookie 34m ago edited 30m ago
Where are you located? In some states, like CA, a dog does not need to be trained as a service dog to be eligible for an accommodation for their owner in many workplace environments such as a basic office. Most workplaces are not public environments, therefore SD training does not apply.
An ESA can be an accommodation,
if it is potty trained, doesn’t interfere w other workers or customers etc.
Location matters.
ultimately, how does the dog Bother you!?
If it doesn’t… none of your business about someone else’s accommodation?
Did the person tell you it’s a service dog?
Can you share what kind of workplace you have (food prep/customers entering etc?)
and what state you are in?
1
u/Xzaral 14h ago
This sounds like it's an ESA, not a service animal. With the behaviors described though, there are actions it can take. Service animals are classified as equipment, and of medical equipment is malfunctioning in a way thats causing a disruption to operations or potentially impacting others then HR can deal with it like any other malfunctioning piece of medical equipment.
2
u/meeps1142 12h ago
ESAs' only legal protection is for housing, not being in public! So there really isn't a distinction between an ESA and regular pet if they're in an office :)
1
u/Xzaral 12h ago
Yeah, I didn't word that well. My initial statement was my suspicion while the rest was advice on how to handle a misbehaving service animal.
1
u/meeps1142 12h ago
Yeah, good info! You can ask service animals to be removed when they are being disruptive. That's why there's no certification or regulated training, but if you don't train your service animal appropriately, you don't receive those special accommodations. It's a good system that lowers the upfront cost for disabled people
1
u/tytyoreo Asshole Enthusiast [8] 14h ago
Sounds like this person made false documents just so they can take the dog everywhere Also Sounds like their mean to the dog
Service animals doesn't act this way and to pinch the dog service animal or not its rude to pinch or hurt say animal
Nta if you can be annoymus then talk to someone
-3
u/PirateLassLV 11h ago
You aren't management, you have no business asking them what tasks the dog performs. I can't imagine being so miserable an office dog is a reason to complain. That's a reason to go to work.
0
u/missfittnc 13h ago
Don't service dogs have to have a training certificate, official documentation or be registered somewhere? Otherwise what's stopping people from calling a regular pet a service dog. Is it more like a comforter or emotional support pet (as opposed to a dog that's more trained for blindness, diabetes, physical disability etc).
Any service dog I've ever come across, the owner has been firm about people not randomly petting and distracting the dog from their job, unless they've been given permission. This situation sounds a bit suss, but tread carefully about how you go about making a complaint. Maybe raise it as a concern, also from an animal welfare point of view and the owner pinching the dogs ears..
0
u/Oyster3425 10h ago
Video the dog's behavior when it acts as a pet/emotional support animal seeking attention. Amplify this with a nonjudgmental list of behaviors it has exhibited and a description of the standard minimum behaviors expected of a service dog from an accredited service dog trainer/organization. List how the dog's nonservice dog behavior has interrupted changed work for you and others. Provide the organized information in a written electronic submission to your supervisor and human resources. Do not address the issue with your coworker as the coworker is physically punishing the dog in the office which also distracts you. Do include your experience with other service animals. Do not address how you feel emotionally about this dog or this coworker. Limit yourself to what you have observed and what you have documented. Leave it in their hands. Request your desk/work area being moved away from the dog as it is interrupting your concentration/ability to address your assigned duties and appears to be affecting productivity at work.
2
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 10h ago
I cannot video at work due to potential HIPAA violations
0
u/Oyster3425 10h ago
HIPAA applies in health care situations. This is confusing. How would videoing the dog violate HIPAA?
0
u/Oyster3425 10h ago
HIPAA applies in health care situations. This is confusing. How would videoing the dog violate HIPAA? How does a dog come to work in a health care situation? So confusing. Perhaps OP is omitting detail that matters to resolution of this situation. Videoing how the dog interacts with coworkers shouldn't be barred by HIPAA. What service is the dog performing -- emotional support?
2
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 9h ago
I work in healthcare. It’s not the dog part that could break HIPAA, it would be having PHI/PII being discussed recorded on my personal phone.
1
u/Oyster3425 4h ago
If you video without recording sound, how would that record personal health information or PII? Are you worried about patients' or coworkers' faces/clothing/voices/activities being recorded? Is the dog seeking attention from patients in this "health" facility?
1
u/Accomplished-Cow7973 4h ago
To my knowledge there is no way to video record on a cell phone without sound, but correct me if I’m wrong. We are not patient facing, but we have computer screens up with patient information nearly at all times and field calls about patients so the risk of catching any of that on a video is extremely high. I work under a heavily scrutinized federal healthcare contract and take privacy seriously, I am not going to risk my job to take a video of the dog.
0
u/gloryhokinetic Asshole Aficionado [14] 9h ago
NTA. Tell management you do not believe it is a real service dog.
0
689
u/Fit-Balance9311 14h ago
man that ear pinch thing is messed up, a real service dog would never act like that and a real handler would never do that