r/videogames • u/NameLips • 9h ago
Discussion / Question Why am I so bad at soulslikes?
I've tried a lot of soulslikes. Basically any game where the primary advice is to "get good" is a game I cannot play.
I once spent a week trying to beat a tutorial boss. It was either Dark Souls 1 or 2. He finally glitched into a wall and got stuck and I killed him.
Then the game started and I died repeatedly to the first monster out there, I think it was some kind of skeleton.
If the game requires me to dodge, I can't play the game. I will miss every dodge. If the game requires me to block, I can't play the game. I will miss every block.
In Expedition 33, I missed every single button press reaction. Every single one. That game let me adjust the difficulty so I managed to finish it.
In Silksong, I got pretty far by sheer grit and determination. My college age son is a huge fan of Hollow Knight, Silksong, and metroidvanias. I played it so I could have something to talk to him about. Some of the bosses took me over 100 tries, some I lost track after 150. I managed to get to Act 3 before finally hitting a wall, I couldn't even get to a boss in Act 3, the regular mobs were too hard. The thing is, I don't honestly think I got any better. I try my hardest each time, and I think after over a hundred tries I just happen to win by sheer random chance. I never felt like I knew what I was doing, or was getting better. The boss fights were always frustrating, not a single one was ever fun.
If there is some kind of currency you lose when you die, even if you can get it back again by reaching your corpse, I just don't get to have that currency. In Silksong I never had shards for my tools. I had tools I didn't even know what they did because I never had the shards to practice with them. I never had the rosaries to unlock things, unless I went back to the starter zone and farmed specifically for that purpose. It might take an hour or so for each thing I wanted to unlock or buy.
I just tried Valor Mortis because it hit Game Pass. I'm assuming there are bosses in that game but I couldn't reach any. I died to the regular mobs and got too frustrated to continue. I was doing kind of all right against the first kind of mobs, where you could block their attacks by holding down block until they attacked, and then respond. I usually had to drink a healing potion after each fight but I got past them. But then I started hitting enemies who turned red and you had to dodge their attacks and... I just couldn't get past them. I couldn't time the dodges. They hit me with every single one of their attacks. I'd burn through all my potions, and then just die.
I understand these games are supposed to be hard. But I don't think they're supposed to be this hard. The problem is me, and all the "get goods" in the world aren't helping me get good.
Watching youtube videos is just frustrating. They say things like "this boss was pretty fun, it took me three tries to beat him. Here is my strategy..." and the strategy will be the most obvious thing in the world. Like "dodge his attacks and then use your tool when he's staggered" or something. And that's great. The strategy is the easy part. I know exactly how to beat the boss. That's not my problem. My problem is execution. I can never make the character on the screen match my vision for what is supposed to happen. The video says to jump over the monster, I try that and instead the monster hits me before I can jump. Or I jump into the monster. Or I land too far away to attack. Or I land in lava. Or the monster's projectile bounces off the wall and kills me. Over and over. Ten tries, fifty tries, a hundred tries, and I'm still making the exact same mistakes, still missing the exact same timings.
I'll watch people playing these games and it's just like magic. I have never had the experience they have. It feels like they're playing a different game. The dodges just work. The enemies deal no damage to them. They're hitting every attack. They're chatting about the strategy they're going to use for the upcoming boss, like they're not even doing anything interesting or special.
I hear people talking about how good some of these games are, like Elden Ring. I feel like I'm missing out on some really good gaming experiences. I just wish I could figure out how to play these sorts of games. At this point I am starting to think I have some kind of mental disability.
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u/Possible-Row6689 7h ago edited 6h ago
I would bet money that you're panicking and hitting dodge/block as soon as the enemy starts to attack rather than waiting for the correct timing. React to their forward motion, not their wind up.
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u/Mossatross 9h ago
I mean do you just have completely fucked reaction time or are you not learning anything from losing?
The way I see it, these games aren't always inherently difficult. But they are mechanical and totally indifferent to you. Some games will let you button mash, give you hints, play themselves out for you. Dark Souls is just determinism. When you press this button under these conditions this happens. It's never going to have pity. If you keep doing the same thing then you get the same outcome. It's kind of a puzzle you have to solve.
It's actually possible to complete the Dark Souls games without rolling or guarding, if you just run in the right direction at the right time. People do this for challenge runs. Not that im reccomending it. Dodging is easier. You understand iframes right?
Are you not understanding in the moment when/where you need to dodge to? Can you not react fast enough to execute what you know needs to happen? Are you pressing another button that's conflicting?
Maybe go into a boss arena and just try to see how long you can not die for and observe when the boss stops moving to be open. Most of the game is just not running into an attack and getting killed. Then you can try attacking. And then it's basically a dance of knowing when to do which without getting greedy.
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u/NameLips 9h ago
Knowing "what to do" is usually the easy part. I usually end up watching a video after 20 or 30 boss attempts, and it always turns out I'm trying the correct things. I can't get the execution right.
Maybe I'm supposed to jump over a fire ring and then dash up and hit the guy. Easy enough, you would think. I think the challenge is supposed to be figuring that out. But I'll miss the jump every time. And then when I finally do make the jump, I don't feel like I did anything different. I can't tell why it works sometimes and not others. Then comes the dash and attack, and instead I'll dash into the enemy and suffer damage. Or I'll get there late and the window will be closed.
Whatever the problem is, it's something I can't see. Some split second thing I'm missing.
It's very hard if there's a runback, because that means I will forget things. I've had boss fights (in silksong) where I die after about 3 seconds in the fight, and the runback takes over a minute. I don't know how I'm supposed to notice, learn, and correct something when I only have 3 seconds to figure out what's going on, and a whole minute to forget it.
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u/Brandunaware 9h ago
How are you at other games?
How is your vision and how are your reflexes?
You say you have a college age son so we can assume you're not 25 anymore. I can tell you that as I've aged my performance has gotten worse. I'm not totally unable to play these types of games (as long as I'm not tired) but my eyes are not as sharp as they once were and the buttons don't press as fast and that hurts my performance for sure.
If your limitations are specific to this genre then I'm not sure what they are, but if in general you're just having a harder time with demanding games you may need new glasses or just may have reached a time where you need options to reduce those demands (like in Expedition 33) and games without them may become inaccessible.
I think most middle aged and even older people can adjust and learn to play most of these types of games, but everyone's different.
There are also specific playstyles in some games that are less demanding of split second reflexes and perfect vision.
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u/NameLips 9h ago
I'm 48. I wear glasses. My vision shouldn't be the problem. I do have pretty severe adhd. If there's a "runback" to a boss, it makes it very hard for me because I feel like every time is the first time, the runback is long enough for me to lose whatever mental progress I've made.
Most soulslike games I have trouble getting through the "tutorial" sequence. Just now I was playing Valor Mortis and I can only assume there are bosses, but I didn't reach the first one. The regular enemies with the "unblockable red attack" were a hard wall for me. I couldn't time my dodge.
I've run into the suggestion of trying different specs or weapons or playstyles for these games, but those usually seem to depend on being able to get far enough in the game where you actually have choices to make. I often can't reach that point.
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u/Onyx_Lat 8h ago
Have you tried Celeste? The whole point is that you basically have zero wait to get back to the place you died.
(I haven't played it either though. Dying in the same place 50 times doesn't sound like my idea of fun.)
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u/SoakingWetFerret 8h ago
Use every death as a lesson. Learn the tells for each boss's/enemy's attacks. When I started i was TERRIBLE. Bosses and parts with normal enemies would take me hours to get by. A few bosses took me a week (30+ hours) to beat. But I kept going and eventually prevailed. I had to rewire my muscle memory from mashing buttons as fast as I could to learning patterns. hit, dodge, hit, hit, dodge, hit, dodge, dodge, block, hit, dodge. You have to be deliberate with every action. It almost turns into a rythem game, like a dance. Another person on here gave you great advice. Go into some fights with no intention of attacking; just practice dodging/blocking/parrying. I wanted to play Elden Ring so bad when it came out i MADE myself git gud. Took me like 300+ hours to beat. Once it clicks these games are amazing.
Also, try some soulslikes with difficulty sliders. Lies of P and Khazan have difficulty options. And summons to help with bosses. Don't give up yet. You can do this. I believe in you.
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u/KeterClassKitten 6h ago
Out of curiosity, what is your gaming set up? Depending on a few factors, there might be a physical disconnect rather than your personal skill. I'm wondering if you're experiencing input lag, and it's just enough to where it's making things difficult but not enough to really be noticeable.
Certain settings on a TV can cause a lag between what's being computed in your device and what's being shown on screen. Especially on older models.
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u/OrangePeelPotatoes 9h ago
If you arent having fun, dont play.
Souls games dont require "getting good". They are primarily about preparedness rather than fast reflexes.
How do you "miss a block"? Just hold shield up.
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u/NameLips 9h ago
Well in the game I was just playing, Valor Mortis, you can hold up your weapon to block. But it's better if you do a perfect block because it staggers the enemy and your next attack does more damage. I could get past those enemies by just holding it down until they attacked, but often they would still hit me when I tried to attack myself. I usually went through one healing potion per fight. Then the game, assuming I had blocking figured out, started introducing the "unblockable" enemies. They turn red and the attack is unblockable, and you have to dodge. The dodge has to be timed correctly. If you dodge too early or too late, the attack will hit. I managed to kill the first one of these enemies, but it took all three of my healing potions. The next time I ran into one of these enemies, it was in a larger battlefield with many other enemies, and by the time I reached him I was out of potions. That's the guy I couldn't get past. He killed me before I could recover my xp, which I found frustrating, because it's still the "tutorial" sequence of the game, and I was close to leveling up.
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u/OrangePeelPotatoes 9h ago
yeah, not sure about Valor Mortis, but in Souls games (not Soulslikes), you can just hold block. No timing is required. You cant really miss blocks and blocks can carry you through the entire game. No rolling needed. No timing needed. No real "skill" in the traditional sense needed. Just exploration and preparedness. Overlevel, find powerful tools, summons, etc. Plenty of diegetic difficulty sliders.
These games, especially the early ones, are less about timing/reflexes and more about "knowing" what to do.
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u/AutumnWhaler 9h ago
Old souls vet here, started with ds1 on release. The games are about dying, learning and trying again. However,
You’re old and your reaction time is shot, I can relate because I’m 36 now and I can’t parry for shit in lies of P, 5 years ago probably wouldn’t have been even an issue. Fundamentally we’re becoming grey beards, while I’m sure there’s some old heads that can keep up with the youth. Most of us had our day in the sun.
But not all is lost, I did a grand slam on darkest dungeon 2 recently, you can still feel the grind without the need for reaction skill.
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u/MurtZero1134 9h ago
It sounds corny, but this works for me:
I repeatedly tell myself "patience is my most powerful weapon."
I was terrible at these games, but taking the time to learn enemy patterns is ket to success. But it requires pateince.
I dont expect to best a boss on my first try. Or me 5th, or 10th, etc...
But I know woth enough patience and tries, edventually I'll succeed
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u/Inevitable-Fish2739 9h ago
I'm also terrible at games. My reflexes are horrible and I get lost very easily. Like, I will miss things that are right in front of me. I think ADHD is part of it. I don't think I could beat a Souls game even if I was offered $10k for it. I had to put Jedi Fallen Order on story mode because it was kicking my ass.
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u/NameLips 8h ago
That's basically what I had to do for the new Control: Resonent." I'm glad it has so many difficulty sliders, I couldn't get past the first boss. You can even turn on one-hit kills if you want.
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u/Onyx_Lat 8h ago
Tbh I would love to try Dark Souls just to see how bad I suck at it. But I don't want to spend money on a game that will probably make me want to defenestrate the game console.
I do seem to have this thing where despite having bad hand eye coordination, I'm good at all the games other people think are hard. Like Zelda 2. Sure it was hard, but no harder than an average 80s platformer. And once you got all your levels maxed out, it let you collect infinite extra lives. So in order to beat it, I just saved up a bunch of extra lives before going to the last palace.
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u/Pender8911 9h ago
You lose when you compare yourself to others and think "oh this guy only died twice I must also die less than that".
Also remember that dying doesn't equal to losing in souls, you're supposed to use that to learn the timing and moves of enemies
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u/NameLips 8h ago
Well it can get pretty frustrating when there's a penalty for dying. Like in the game I was just playing. Valor Mortis, you can lose XP when you die. If you get back to where you died you can recover it, but all the enemies have respawned.
I've been frustrated by this mechanic in other games before. It means I don't get to level up.
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u/LittleKittyBumbuns 5h ago
That's the whole point of soulslikes
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u/NameLips 5h ago
Well no, the point is to encourage the player to learn and improve so they avoid the consequence. The point isn't to outright prevent leveling.
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u/LittleKittyBumbuns 4h ago
I meant the point of souls games is to lose your xp when you die and for the enemies to respawn
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u/KobeJuanKenobi9 9h ago
Just because other people enjoy mechanically difficult games doesn’t mean you have to. It’s ok that those games just aren’t for you. It doesn’t make you any less than those that like those games.
If you want to play a game that’s difficult without worrying about button prompts or timing I recommend Metaphor Refantazio. The difficulty comes with tactics and planning, but the gameplay itself is completely turn based with no timed QTEs or anything like that
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u/Onyx_Lat 8h ago
Tbh I feel like Caves of Qud is basically the Dark Souls of turn based combat. I have died in all kinds of unfair situations, but somehow it never gets old, even with permadeath on.
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u/AdAffectionate2418 8h ago
Sounds like it might be a reaction-time issue - how do you fair against other "hard" games that aren't action based? Darkest Dungeon, XCOM thing like that?
Some people just dont have the reflexes that these rougelike action games require. It seems like you like the strategy part so maybe you can find something just as diabolically challenging but that plays to your strengths?
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u/NameLips 8h ago
I'm fairly good at those sorts of games, though I do get frustrated when I make the smartest possible strategic decision and the rng still screws me. I guess that's supposed to be the point of games like xcom though, you can still lose with perfect play.
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u/AdAffectionate2418 8h ago
Definitely makes me recite my "circle of influence vs circle of concern" mantra. Though I'm not sure if ive played perfectly when it comes to xcom. Any losses have always been due to poor risk-management on my part (always assume your 95% shots will miss, always have a back-up plan).
As someone with ADHD myself - I have to be in the right space for soulsborne games; and will often go months without playing them before spending weeks playing nothing but them.
The biggest test is patience. The streamers won't show you this as their skill level eclipses yours and mine. When I encounter a new boss, I'll often do a few runs where I don't even try to get a hit in - instead I'll stay back and try to figure out the long-range attack patterns, where I need to position myself, what can be blocked/dodged/parried etc. Then I'll do the same in middle and close range. - that lets me learn the attacks, but it also calms my nerves and helps me focus. I then feel much more prepared when I start fighting "for real".
And, if you do this already, try speed-running back to your corpse. It won't always work, but you'd be surprised how many enemies you can run past/kite etc - especially if you are going to a boss encounter where the mobs cant follow you.
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u/DrNanard 8h ago
Have you considered that you might have some kind of impairment? How are your reflexes in real life? How good are you at sports?
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u/NameLips 8h ago
I have never played sports outside of PE class as a child, and I was no good at those.
I mentioned elsewhere that I can't dance, I can't make my body coordinate with the beat. I can't play simple hand games like pat-a-cake, I always go too fast or slow.
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u/avedominuswife 5h ago
I mean, that’s the answer. You cannot make your fingers press the buttons in the right way at the right time
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u/DoubleSummon 8h ago
It sounds like you are too impatient or lack the observation skill to time your dodges/parries. or your confidence is so low you just give up. Dunno if you didn't improve at all so far maybe try other genres that fit you better.
I know I have terrible aim, so I don't play any shooters cause I don't find those game fun. same principle for you and souls.
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u/NohWan3104 8h ago
Practice can make perfect. If you have a switch, i'd suggest getting paper mario TTYD. It has a timing thing, but theres a badge you can wear to show you the timing, so you can actually learn, the move looks like this and the right point to hit the button is here.
Elden ring might be easier (is) just because its open world, so a lot of decent stuff isn't gated behind a boss, no tutorial boss that must be beat, etc. Theres a lot of different types of skills, most with a handful of ways to boost them, it isn't DS1. Hell i beat radagon, a tough mobile boss the last fight untouched, just cause i got kinda lucky with a rock sling stun (first build was gravity mage)
I had to turn it to easy and use def in E33 too, you can probably not dodge in ER. E33 went out of its way to fuck you over, don't feel too bad.
"dodge his attacks' IS simple. As an idea. Its not easy, because you have to know what those attacks are, anticipate them, how to dodge them (i don't mean the button, i mean, forward, almost never back, left, right) - it takes both timing and knowledge to beat.
You're trying to copy a pro at a skill based game without the skill and knowledge, just won't work.
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u/ffottron 5h ago
To be honest, if you can’t play games that require a quick reaction time, you’re never going to be get into these. Just not gonna happen.
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u/MidRanchWest 4h ago
Sounds like difficult action games aren't your cup of tea. Try something else if you're not having fun, it's just that easy
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u/Organic-Economics746 9h ago
Dude, I love souls games,I have beaten very hard sekiro bosses on my second try, just goofing with my friend who was stuck on it. I have never beaten demon souls and it took me 8 years to beat dark souls. They are just really hard, especially if core mechanic timing is wrong.
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u/RacketandClunk 9h ago
What are you talking about demons souls is by far the easiest souls game from soft ever made
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u/Organic-Economics746 8h ago
I got the the boss who drains your levels and I spent enough time getting them I wanted to make sure he didn't get any, and then just sorta forgot I had I think him and the "final boss" thing
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u/Organic-Economics746 9h ago
It's called "my personal experience" you'll notice that everyone has one, and they are all a little different from each other.
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u/RacketandClunk 8h ago
Fair enough but for me i was stuck on dark souls and then I got demons souls and that game did such a good job teaching me to play souls games by the end i was able to beat the final boss first try and dark souls was finally manageable for me.
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u/Organic-Economics746 8h ago
I had demons souls before dark souls even came out🥲🥲 if you can beat O and S nothing in demons is hard besides well, the levels if you want to actually fight everything in it and gd flamelurker
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u/ghost-bagel 9h ago
95% of soulslike players suck and die more often than they will admit. A minority of highly skilled players make it look easy. They’re usually the ones making the videos.
Anyway, it’s a mindset thing. Dying 10-20 times on one boss feels excessive, and it might be for a Zelda or God of War. For a soulslike it’s totally normal and just part of the journey.
When people say get good, I think the best advice is get used to trial and error while you learn. Once the psychological hit of dying loads goes away, the games become addictive as hell. I’ve died 20+ times to bosses and never gotten sick of the process.
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u/NameLips 9h ago
I think it would be less frustrating if I ever felt like I was getting better or learning anything. It usually takes me at least 50 deaths before I start to get frustrated. What I need to do is usually very obvious and simple, like "jump over this attack, dodge this other attack, and don't stand in the black goo." And I'll be missing every jump, failing every dodge, and landing in the goo. And in 20 tries I'll have made that jump once, and it feels exactly the same. I have no idea what I did differently. I just do what feels like the exact same thing over and over until, by pure accident, it just happens to work.
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9h ago
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u/TheAkrioz 8h ago
I don't think A Hat in Time is the way, man can't dodge telegraphed things, how is he supposed to do platforming with a lot of moving obstacles?
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u/Internal_Context_682 8h ago
You're not missing out on anything that hasn't been done before. Trick to any game that requires strategy? Never go first. Only time you should is if you're under a turn time limit. For Souls games of any kind, know your weapon first, use what's best for you. Hell I played Dragons Dogma before and I go for what keeps me moving or perhaps something that helps is what works if you wanna play keep away. Learn your play style and master it. It'll take some time but it can be done. You don't need to be good or get good in any game, it pays to know what you're dealing with first and act accordingly.
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u/Deus_Synistram 9h ago
Im going to be blunt.
You either have an extremely rare issue where you register information on an extreme delay in which case get checked out cause you can't drive safely.
Or you are impatient/unobservant. A lot of people starting souls games are use to games letting you just smash your way through enemies. In this genre you have to respect the enemies. You have to react to them. Not act before them.
If you really want to "git gud" load any one of these games and don't try to fight the boss/enemy. Just watch for when the attack starts coming at you and dodge then. Do that until you are spending minutes not getting hit. Then try light attacking immediately after you dodge the hit (or chain of hits).
If you master that you can beat every game in the genre