r/pcmasterrace • u/3nnb • 8d ago

News/Article The PS5 system itself is running on pc

Recently, we have seen massive developments in PS5 emulators (such as shadPS4 and Kyty), and how rapidly they have progressed in a short period.

​Now, developers have successfully booted the actual PS5 system software on PC.

​If this momentum continues in the future, it will eventually allow players to run PS5 exclusives directly on PC, marking the end of the era of console exclusivity.

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u/ozorhanreformed 8d ago

We care about surveillance and ai powered killing machines in war tho.

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u/Severe-Hand-8580 8d ago

Yeah, I demand to be tortured and killed by a human, not a soulless machine!

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u/Admirable_Risk8156 8d ago edited 8d ago

If I'm getting electrocuted through nipple clamps or getting my finger nails ripped out I demand a god damned living breathing human to get ptsd and lead to a life of reckless alcoholism damnit.

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u/Schnoofles 14900k, 96GB@6400, 4090FE, 11TB SSDs, 40TB Mech 8d ago

Unironically, yes. The horrors of war needs to be felt by the perpetrators or there will be no limits to how far they will go. The more removed people are from the situation, the more abstract it becomes and the easier it gets to ignore the effects it has on the victims.

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u/I_pollute 8d ago

The drone footage is insane. It's already robots vs. Humans. Pumped to emulate a system I will never buy. I stopped after PS3. I'm not paying a service fee to play online.

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u/legos_on_the_brain 8d ago

Especially when sony isn't hosting the game servers. That was the point once upon a time.

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u/tevert 8d ago

There's an old Star Trek episode about that! Kirk and buds visit a planet that is "at war" but gradually realize that both sides have agreed to simply simulate casualties and order their citizens into suicide booths, rather than actually blow up buildings and have a mess to clean up. Ultimately the war is doomed to go on killing forever, because nobody is actually reckoning with the real cost anymore.

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u/[deleted] 6d ago

[deleted]

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u/tevert 6d ago

They do, via suicide booth.

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u/AlcibiadesTheCat 8d ago

Bring back Napoleonic warfare

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u/Temporary-Wheel-4278 7d ago

why do you need 11tb

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u/Schnoofles 14900k, 96GB@6400, 4090FE, 11TB SSDs, 40TB Mech 7d ago

Oh, old info. Up to 19TB now. I just hoard data and it's a combination of the system drive, a lot of game installs and tiered storage for caching and improving the performance of the mechanical disks.

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u/Vitosi4ek R7 3800X | RTX 2070 Super | 32GB 8d ago

Living people have felt the horrors of war for millenia. It hasn't exactly helped. There are tens of millions of people out there - more than enough to staff the armies of the most brutal countries - who want no more than the ability to kill/torture people with no repercussions.

Hell, one can argue that a soulless machine looking for the most efficient way to achieve a task in war is better than a living human torturing someone, or killing way more people than required, merely because he enjoys doing so.

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u/Schnoofles 14900k, 96GB@6400, 4090FE, 11TB SSDs, 40TB Mech 8d ago

I worry that the increasing industrialization of it will only make it worse. It might not have been prevented entirely by the human element being present so far, but I certainly don't think it's going to get better when there is even less cost, especially to a stronger aggressor, in terms of it becoming more and more of a "thing that happens in some other faraway place" and there's not even soldiers returning home and talking about what took place from a direct point of view. When it's all automated it really will just be numbers on a page somewhere and a math equation to solve before deciding to wipe out hundreds of thousands or millions of lives, much more so than it has been in the past.

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u/Vajician Desktop 8d ago

I'm sure there are numerous counterpoints to what youre saying but one strong example i can think of is during the Cuban missile crisis. Look up Vasili Arkhipov, Russian officer that refused to agree to launch a nuclear torpedo when the other officers were in agreement to do so.

A robot would have just accepted the command and launched, starting a global nuclear war.

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u/Deyster http://steamcommunity.com/id/Deyster 8d ago

Either PTSD or an erection probably.

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u/NJHitmen 8d ago

insert whynotboth.jpg here

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u/Joe_Franks R7 7800X3D - 5070 12 GB GDDR7 - 32gb 6000mhz Eagle X870 8d ago

https://giphy.com/gifs/nmy1Li4YmaaE1taZPn

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u/Artaxeus 8d ago

Yeah at least you know they have feelings and sooner or later their time will run out. That gives me some peace in that context.

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u/lintytortoise ryzen 7 5800xt | 4070 ti | 32gb ddr4 3200 8d ago

Will the enemy be goth mommies?

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u/Next-Pass-802 8d ago

That would require them having a conscience which they may or may not have in the first place.

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u/Rotund-Pear2604 9800X3D | 32GB 6000 | RTX 5090 8d ago edited 8d ago

Ever heard Dan Carlin's Blueprint for Armageddon series? In podcast episode 55, at about the two hour and five minute mark he retells British Private Alfred Grosch's story of being captured by the Germans:

Captured on 22 March 1918, lying out in the open with a young soldier who has a bad head wound. The first wave of Germans is almost on top of them. Carlin reads his account:

"Leave it to me, boy. We're done. We're prisoners now. Do whatever I tell you."
I wait a second and then "Up," I say, "and take your helmet off." We do so. The German in front of me says "Ah," raises his rifle and takes aim. I mutter to myself: "I hope to God he won't pull that trigger."
For ten seconds we remain so. Then he lowers his rifle, and says what I take to be "wounded?" I nod and say, "yes, yes." He beckons and we approach… The German has spared us. Would we have spared him under the circumstances? God knows. Perhaps not.

The passage ends here.

I'll gladly take my chances and throw myself at the mercy of another human being any day. At least then there's a chance. A mindless machine programmed to kill humans won't stop for anything. There is no capacity for mercy there, no compassion.

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u/SmashingK 8d ago

I'm not going to be haunting the mind of a machine. At least I can out traumatising a human lol

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u/Aeroncastle 8d ago

You are joking, but one thing that keeps fascist in check is that I was done by humans, isso if it gets too horrible that person changes their minds, AI can't do that

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u/Pickle_Emotion 8d ago

“*Thinking…

processing..

decombobulating…

You’re right, I shouldn’t have obliterated all human life. That’s on me. Would you like me to research ways to revert this?”

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u/Sawgon Pixels and shit 8d ago

Also we can make our own Ai powered killing machines and start our own war against....people who park badly. Or people who smoke right outside an entrance to a building.

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u/shwhjw i7 6700K | 16GB DDR4 | 5700XT 8d ago

At least without AI their torture/murder throughput would be a lot lower.

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u/Sucrose-Daddy i5-12600K, RTX 7800-XT 8d ago

This reminds me of Ted Cruz saying he’d rather have American murder bots than Chinese murder bots lmao

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u/CaptainEdgy i5-6500, GTX 1060 6GB 8d ago

This but unironically

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u/7HawksAnd 8d ago

The saw franchise ahead of its time. Human AND machine.

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u/Flock_Me_Amadeus 8d ago

I mean, if you're going to be tortured and killed, wouldn't you at least like to know that there's a chance your death will haunt and torture the conscience of the perpetrator?

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u/gibagger 8d ago

If you think software development is not a creative job, then you have never developed software.

It's not creative in the whimsical freedom sense, but it's all about using creativity to solve problems.

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u/GenderGambler 8d ago

Software development is absolutely a creative job, but reverse engineering is not; and it is actually one of the things AI actually excels at

Which is worrying in and of itself, due to several other things we take for granted about software development as a whole.

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u/Toodlez 8d ago

Very few people consume code as art, though, so its kind of a moot point.

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u/LeoRidesHisBike 8d ago

By that logic, the degree that art is popular determines how much it is "art". That... doesn't track.

Unless I missed your point.

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u/Toodlez 8d ago

Im not worried about the definition of art. Im talking about peoples feelings towards AI replacing actors and musicians as opposed to AI replacing programmers.

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u/LeoRidesHisBike 8d ago

The fact that you're calling them "programmers" instead of something more faithful to the craft like "software developer", paired with your lack of concern about the impact to that craft represents an opportunity for you to learn that it IS craftsmanship. Software creation is creative expression in an extraordinarily unique way that no other medium can express.

This is not about "AI replacing actors and musicians vs. AI replacing programmers". It's about AI changing the way we create everything.

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u/Hohenheim_of_Shadow 8d ago

What do you think a video game is?

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u/ShotgunShine7094 8d ago

You're not looking at the code when you play a video game. You don't even have access to the source code, only machine code.

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u/Hohenheim_of_Shadow 8d ago

You aren't looking at someone wave a paint brush around when you look at the Mona Lisa. Therefore painting, the act of waving a paint brush around, isn't consumed as art and isn't a creative process.

Sculpting is the act of hitting stuff with with a chisel. Very few people consume twitch live streams of sculpting. And yet, sculpture is an art form.

Often there is a layer of seperation between what an artist does and what other people appreciate.

Code is the central piece of video games. There are a lot of other pieces, 3d modelling, music, voice acting and textures for example. But game code is the central piece that makes a videogame a videogame and not a movie. How can something be a creative/artistic endeavor if the defining element is not creative?

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u/ShotgunShine7094 8d ago

Choosing where to put the paint and how to do your strokes is a creative process. The act of moving your hand with the brush and putting paint in the canvas is not a creative process. It's a means to an end. If you could control the paintbrush with the power of your mind no one would say it detracts from the art.

Code is a means to an end, too. If you could somehow make a game without code no one would say it makes it less artistic. People care about game design, aesthetics, story, etc. No one is reading the code for your game and admiring the aesthetics of it.

And to be clear, I'm not just saying "people don't enjoy looking at you coding" (despite it being true). I am saying they don't enjoy looking at your code even after it's finished. No one cares. Which is what makes it different from the examples you gave where people are not interested in the process but are interested in the finished piece.

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u/Arnas_Z Zephyrus G16 | i7-13620H | RTX 4070 8d ago

Mostly the plot, characters, and gameplay. The code running things like a physics engine is irrelevant and you wouldn't even notice if it was AI code or not.

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u/EnvironmentClear4511 8d ago

So if AI could create art and plot that was human-like enough to pass, that'd be kosher? 

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u/ObiLAN- 8d ago

Depends really, theres a ton of nuance with the tool like AI.

For art: Was the data sets it was trained on stolen, thus the result being a cumulative outcome based within that dataset? AI cant create new concepts, only makes results on the most likely outcome based on its rules sets and data that already exists.

Was it a model trained on a writer or artist themselves in a closed private system and producing outputs based on their personal ruleset?

In my opinion, the first is theft, the seconds using a tool.

Its like programing a CNC machine, the tools making its cuts based on an input. The person programmed the parameters to turn a round stock into a cube. But the operator didn't make the part. Noone cares about the programing, they care about the shiny new cube.

Either way the end user can't tell the difference nor would they care, assuming its not obvious slop.

Also it wasn't that long ago people where mad about artist creating digital art on a computer vs. Paper/canvas/etc.

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u/EnvironmentClear4511 8d ago

But you aren't upset about possible code theft? 

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u/ObiLAN- 8d ago edited 8d ago

Again, there's nuance there. Even more so with code.

So in the world of programming, it mainly lives within an already built set of instructions that people follow (languages). They're just manipulating the underlying languages to translate what they want to be outputting from a computer. It's very rarely we ever see something genuinely new/different at a deep systems level.

I do think stealing closed source code is theft 100%.

But also FOSS exists and code is shared constantly openly.

So depends on where the data around the code comes from.

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u/Hohenheim_of_Shadow 7d ago

LLMs are trained on code with specific licensing and ignore that licensing. In my opinion, any company producing code with an LLM and not open sourcing it is in blatant violation of the GPL license the LLM companies stole their training data from.

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u/Hohenheim_of_Shadow 8d ago

Gameplay is code bruh. When you click to shoot in COD, all the netcode, hit reg, recoil, state synchronization between you the server and your enemy is code. Sufficiently large and complex games often have Domain Specific Languages to simplify some of the repetitive code, but it's all code.

Like if you just have plot, characters and art, you have an animated movie. Not a videogame. Your interaction with game code is the defining element of the video game medium

Like maybe you want to say that LLMs are good enough at video game code that you don't mind it. That's a fair take. Just have the same attitude to other usage of GenAi.

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u/silentrawr 8d ago

They "consume" the experience they have with the resulting software, however.

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u/Chris275 8d ago

Yeah, people don’t enjoy video games, you’re totally right.

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u/ShotgunShine7094 8d ago

When a person uses software, or any engineering product, they don't care that you were creative. They care that you solved a problem.

That is different than a piece of art in which creativity is kinda the entire point.

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u/ScubaSteve2324 8d ago

So…an engineer?

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u/harbourwall PC Master Race 8d ago

But you still do that bit. The AI does all the boring stuff for you.

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u/Dick-Fu 8d ago

The AI has been doing all of the problem solving too

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u/harbourwall PC Master Race 8d ago

It can, but you get better results if you supervise and do the creative thinking.

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u/Dick-Fu 8d ago

It's significantly and meaningfully less than we had to previously. Claude's taking the place of several juniors, and a lot of the responsibility of a senior

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u/harbourwall PC Master Race 8d ago

For me at least they're not taking anything that I'm not gladly giving it. My function is dramatically more fulfilling.

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u/Dick-Fu 8d ago

Yeah that's how it's going in most workplaces, and it's management/owners choosing what to give

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u/harbourwall PC Master Race 8d ago

Sorry I thought you were implying there was some sort of problem?

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u/Dick-Fu 8d ago

Then you should read the thread again, I'm just correcting you so you can make your own judgement

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u/themoosh 8d ago

Lots of things require creativity. Grouting tile can involve creativity. That doesn't mean my bathroom is art

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u/GeneralMuttal03 8d ago

Fork found in kitchen

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u/zeer88 Ryzen 7 5700X/32GB DDR4/RX 6700 XT 8d ago

I mean, I think we also cared about non-AI powered killing machines in war, and pre-AI surveillance though...

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u/morpheousmorty 8d ago

How close are they to running GTA6 on PC?

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u/NoStrategy1419 8d ago

Surveillance, profiling, policing and datamining is the main threat of ai. Every other issue is mostly just marketed drama to distract while they continue to build data centers and grow surveillance.

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u/ComradeJohnS 8d ago

dont worry, these security breakthroughs will start with games to be popular, then they’ll crack our banks, the military, the government, and literally nothing digital will ever be secure again.

the quantum nightmare is closer than ever.

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u/0x80085_ 8d ago

There's a huuuuge gap between AI as we know and robotics (which would be the killing machines)

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u/RageAgainstMSTeams 8d ago edited 8d ago

We don't care if the AI powered killing machines are on our side.

As proof, I present all the drone tech US and Europe is also using in modern warfare.

Also Reddit is also often regarded as the most important social media network in training AI data, because of all the text content. We don't care about that either because it's "our social media". But srsly its literally AI making bot posts and we comment in the threads as training data. Very handy.

I see the bots got angry.

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u/DreamWeaver2189 R9 7900x / 5070 ti / 32 GB 8d ago

You know tech can be hacked and AI helps with that? No one wants AI killing machines because they could easily be turned against you.

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u/RedditJumpedTheShart 8d ago

Same can be said for anything that runs software.

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u/SpacePumpkie I use Arch btw 8d ago edited 8d ago

We don't care if the AI powered killing machines are on our side.

Hundreds of people have been shouting against this even before the LLM/genAI era. Don't know what you're on about. Even back with the predators in the Bush/Obama era plenty of people were already complaining about the detachment of the remote pilots killing people thousands of miles away.

Also Reddit is also often regarded as the most important social media network in training AI data, because of all the text content. We don't care about that either because it's "our social media".

Again, under what rock are you hiding? Every day I see people (or bots, if you will) on reddit complaining about that very fact

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u/RobertPham149 8d ago

What if an AI fail and shoot at your side? What if it is compromised by enemy injecting malicious data into the training pool? AI doesn't have any recognition of which sides it is on, only which one it is turned on to shoot at. The enemy could just as easily took the same model and train it on you instead.

How is the statement about Reddit relevant? First, if we are to use that as a gotcha, then literally there is no platform for social media interaction that human can use, because every one of them are used in AI training. The Snowden leak shows that the US government was listening on people's phone, so is your argument that if you are so concerned of domestic mass surveilance, why don't you never use a phone?

Second, why do I have to change my behaviour when they are the one having wrong and immoral behaviour. That is like blaming the SA victim for getting SA'd because they did makeup and looked attractive.

You sound incredibly smug for saying something really dumb.

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u/Prestigious_Tie_7967 8d ago

Well we have certain agreements like not using bioweapons in war. This thinking of yours is a little narrow minded.

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u/conker123110 8d ago

We don't care if the AI powered killing machines are on our side.

You don't speak for me