r/minnesotatwins • u/Winnes0ta Land O Rakes • 15d ago
[Nightengale] Tom Pohlad: “We are going to be aggressive when free agency starts.” He said ownership will “meaningfully invest” into the roster.
https://bsky.app/profile/nightengalejr.bsky.social/post/3mwobfj4dgk2i52
u/cothomps Sue Nelson 15d ago
Using this thread, noting other big news:
- Zoll keeps his job.
- Walker Jenkins having surgery to remove chips from elbow.
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u/TheRealSheevPalpatin Jorge Polanco 15d ago
I’m not seeing the Jenkins news could you provide sauce pls
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u/cothomps Sue Nelson 15d ago
Sorry - same Bluesky thread from Bobby Nightengale:
https://bsky.app/profile/nightengalejr.bsky.social/post/3mwo7nwxees2i
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u/HorneeAttornee T.C. Bear 15d ago
I hate when I pull up the elbow cushion and find all the chips underneath. No matter how clean I try and be, they always find their way down there.
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u/InsideMyScars 15d ago
Same shit I had happen to me after a broken arm and lost my baseball scholarship for it lol thank god Walker doesn’t have a scholarship to lose and he’s going to get WAAAAAY better care
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u/SensitiveLack7509 15d ago
"There's going to be a salary floor and we'll be forced to spend significantly more money than before"
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u/Internal-Platypus151 15d ago
There won't be a salary floor
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u/GreatLoon Minnesota Twins 15d ago
Every move I’ve seen this team make in the last year has been an extra plate of breadsticks to distract from the lack of an entree.
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u/Griffinkelly1 Walker Jenkins 15d ago
Am I insane for believing him? It doesn’t feel like he’s his brother. They made 3 moves for arms at the deadline and traded youth for proven win now arms and it just didn’t work out, but they did try. The trades from last year ended up rearing their ugly heads but I feel like Tom has shown he’s at least trying.
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u/Him2Notorious 15d ago
No. Because at least with Tom you KNOW he knows how the family is perceived.
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u/McBirdman99 15d ago
He's well aware that they've lost the public trust, and the result has been awful attendance. They have to earn trust. I think Tom gets this.
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u/Prez731 Joe Ryan 14d ago
Just like Joe got it, just like Jim got it, just like Carl got it...right. The given name changes, but a Pohlad is a Pohlad. Not a single Pohlad has given one iota about the fans, just the bottom line, and so far Tom hasn't really proven that he's any different. After all, he was part of the family that forced Joe to cut payroll after 23, he was part of the family that put so much family debt upon the team that scuttled the team sale.
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u/Treestroyer Minnesota Twins 15d ago
I disagree with that guess. I don’t think he knows they lost public trust. Do you not remember the kerfuffle that happened at the start of the season when someone was chanting sell the team in front of him.
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u/mediumrainbow Luis Arraez 14d ago
Pro: Tom is saying the same things as the fans. Con: Tom has a last name.
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u/obsidianop 15d ago
Cynicism is easy points on the internet but it would be hard to believe he's so dumb and out of touch he'd do say this and then do nothing.
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u/taffyowner Minnesota Twins 15d ago
Yeah Tom has somewhat backed up his talk so far, so I’m willing to hear him out
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u/Hollywood42cards Minnesota Twins 15d ago
The problem is the goalposts are not where they once were. I'm not going to give the owners any credit for adding $20M in payroll when they were the ones that slashed $40M off payroll a few years ago and haven't replaced it. The same way I'm not going to applaud us signing a few ok veterans in free agency just because owners have gotten us used to getting nothing in free agency at all
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u/A_Hanging_Noose Dick Bremer 15d ago
Zero reason they can’t get back to 130 or (if they really want to get crazy) 160.
There’s pieces here, and the gaps in the roster are stupidly obvious and wouldn’t break the bank to address.
Lowest Twins attendance since 2000 and who the hell knows what the CBA stuff will bring. Cant think of an easier way to juice up some desperately needed enthusiasm.
Tom has definitely been less infuriating than Joe, and here’s his first full, unimpeded offseason at the helm. No more convenient excuses.
If it’s more BS? Oh well, they can continue their mediocre death spiral.
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u/cothomps Sue Nelson 15d ago
Zero reason they can’t get back to 130 or (if they really want to get crazy) 160.
I think the biggest challenge that I see going into all of this is that it would be great to bump payroll, but what player out there in free agency in 2027 is a real needle-mover?
It seems like the big money piece out there will be Skubal and after that a host of pretty okay players that might not be the best fits with the current roster. (e.g. Chisolm, Arozorena). Maybe a Bo Bichette? (Maybe?)
If there is going to be a chunk of free agent spending it probably will be (and maybe should) be on a few solid-but-not-superstar pieces, some depth at key positions.
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u/A_Hanging_Noose Dick Bremer 15d ago
I’m happy with focusing on depth. Splooge on the bullpen (comparatively cheap!), maybe grab another Dean Kremer~ish SP, and address the classic 1B/DH mess.
Whatever it takes to END the nonsense of this team being a brutal watch in August and September.
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u/TheCatCrusader 15d ago
Yeah I agree. I don't think I see a good way for this team to get to 160 in a way that I like in just one off-season.
it probably will be (and maybe should) be on a few solid-but-not-superstar pieces, some depth at key positions.
Yeah I think if they are actually going to spend money, this is the way to do it. Focus on adding depth, plugging holes in the roster, and keeping guys around who are adding to the team but getting expensive.
I just want to see them continually make moves that aren't clearly because they're cheap af, and in a couple years we'll be at a reasonable payroll.
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u/AccomplishedDust3 14d ago
Is there even going to be a 2027 season?
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u/cothomps Sue Nelson 14d ago
Every post / comment on the board comes with the unspoken disclaimer.
*** Provided that resolution of labor issues allows a 2027 season.
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u/Hollywood42cards Minnesota Twins 15d ago
And "getting crazy" at $160M would still be below the 2023 high point of $177M, and in reality is even further behind the curve than then due to payroll growth
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u/A_Hanging_Noose Dick Bremer 15d ago
Yeah lol I probably should’ve added a + at the end but I’m just operating in the depressing reality of Twins baseball. If they actually shot for that 15th-18th in payroll range I’d be ecstatic.
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u/kramitol 12d ago
Salary is not the only answer for the Twins. Unless they draft and develop pitching, they will continue to struggle. Regime change from the Falvey/Levine fiasco is warranted, but the remnants of the old regime are still all over the organization. Cleveland and Tampa Bay drew first round playoff byes because of their young, home grown, talented pitching staffs, not their free agent salaries.
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u/DrAbeSacrabin Griffin Jax 15d ago
I think it’s easy for him to give these kind of answers now because of the likelihood of a lockout.
He can change his mind after it’s resolved citing changes in the CBA.
I’m more interested in his plan post-CBA. Like if there’s a salary cap/floor then yeah - of course he’ll be spending more in FA.
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u/Physical-Lettuce-868 Torii Hunter 15d ago edited 15d ago
I remember he mentioned when he took over that he didn’t like the “wait until January/February to sign guys” approach.
Part of that is the typically tight purse strings so I guess we will see.
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u/Pure-Tip4300 15d ago
Even a semi-cynic view means that could happen. Based on the current owners proposal a cap floor would require them to significantly increase the payroll. If you see that coming anyway, you can add the payroll now and look like you’re doing it by free will and not because you’re forced to.
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u/Apprehensive-Toe3760 15d ago
In fairness, his brother tried and spent. It just seems like the last 24 months, the family pulled the rug and decided to cut spending. Not sure I trust Tom. He’s part of the family that decided to cut spending.
Now all of a sudden, he’s seen the light and the team needs to invest before the fans come? Pffft. These guys are 3rd generation owners. This cannot be news to them.
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u/LemonSmashy 15d ago edited 15d ago
Yes, you are insane. He's a Pohlad. The family has literally had decades to show us that they mean anything other than just using the franchise as a piggy bank. It wasn't until the bottom fell out that they suddenly started to "care". Tom was brought in because he's better at public speaking and he was only brought in to slow the attendance bleeding and try and recoup as much revenue as possible. He will say and do just enough to get fans interested again and the moment it feels safe. The cutbacks and complacency will go back to status quo. Not to mention going public that Zoll is your gut is the thin veil that you don't care or understand. If there was an ounce of integrity in that family and an actual turn of wanting to compete, they would gut that front office and management And actually go out and hire some people with some actual smarts and the balls to do what needs to be done. The only way we see an actual investment monetary wise is if there is a floor in place and they are forced to . Nothing that comes out of this family is of the best interest of the franchise And it is sad and quite frankly pathetic how many people have bought into the shtick once again. Seriously? We're bragging about "investing 8 million" at the deadline while consciously choosing to ignore all the glaring holes during the entire off-season and then trying to patch them up with a used bubble gum. That is just shows you how sad the expectations are when that is, what's considered the aggressive approach.
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u/Ok-Deal-8479 Minnesota Twins 14d ago
The loop of Twins fans is pathological. Terry Ryan gets fired and everyone is like "oh thank god, no more low-wattage deadline moves and maybe we'll actually participate in free agency now," and ten years later it's "The latest Pohlad added $6mil to the payroll this summer after the firesale last year, that is hardcore evidence this team, after almost 40 years of the same thing over and over and over again, is actually very serious now."
I'm sure the private equity fund in New York that owns part of the team now is ready to spend spend spend, lol
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u/santeli Minnesota Twins 15d ago
Would I rather have Tom then any other Pohlad at this point? Hell yes. I think he's the first Pohlad in a while who is pointed in the right direction for this team long term. Do I believe he can over come years of mismanagement in free agency that will bring credibility back in the eyes of the fans? I'll stay skeptical, but not cynical, until I see the results.
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u/Willing-Body-7533 15d ago
What a joke , once they realize the likelihood is very high that there is going to be a $171 million salary cap floor for next season, and they are roughly $80 million short of the minimum, then let's tweet out "we are going to meaningfully invest" !!! Like wtf who are you kidding man
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u/Ok-Deal-8479 Minnesota Twins 14d ago
half this sub buys into it full froth lol
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u/normalfinnesotan 14d ago
And the other half knows that when a Pohlad is making promises to "invest in the team" and "bring a championship to Minnesota", it's just bluster.
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u/Reesyrz Johan Santana 15d ago
The level to "meaningfully invest" is subjective, but the trade deadline effort was a positive start. The bigger issues might be the underwhelming free agent class and/or any potential lockout issues.
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u/LemonSmashy 15d ago
Tom is banking on labor negotiations stalling so that he can use that as his excuse Right now it's all big talk to try and get fans intert.
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u/Extremelixer Pablo López 15d ago
Meaningfully invest indicates to me they are going to attempt to retain Jeffers, extend Ryan and rework the bullpen and maybe try rehiring Wes Johnson for the pitching.
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u/Vitzkyy 15d ago
He can meaningfully invest sure and he’s already proven he will
Now it’s up to the front office to correctly construct a roster with an increased budget. Remember, bigger payroll does not directly increase your team’s performance. They need to make wise moves more than just spend money to prove they can.
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u/derpdeederpa Cole Sands 15d ago
I'm really hoping we can pick up 3-5 corner outfielder left handed bats to replace Larnach and Wallner
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u/Unfrozen__Caveman Vahn Lackey 15d ago
But would that even be enough?
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u/JimmyScribbler 15d ago
Not really
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u/derpdeederpa Cole Sands 15d ago
I mean I bet we could shop some of our bullpen arms and plus defenders to get another league average corner bat if budget becomes an issue in free agency
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u/Hollywood42cards Minnesota Twins 15d ago
and he’s already proven he will
what
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u/Vitzkyy 15d ago
He has, he spent money at the trade deadline on a team that was barely hanging on in a poor AL league. It did not work out but he spent the money.
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u/Hollywood42cards Minnesota Twins 15d ago
"Spent the money" amounting to what, a few million prorated dollars on improving at the margins with a few relievers and a back end starter? This family has a hell of a long ways to go before they earn back any benefit of the doubt
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u/mostdope92 Jhoan Duran 15d ago
Exactly. I'm so tired of people pointing to the deadline as if it is some defining moment where it was proven that ownership will spend money to contend. They brought in a few arms that barely raised the payroll and clearly weren't going to push this team into securing an AL central title or WC birth.
It was nice to see some activity but it was the equivalent of dropping a dime in a well. It was something but it didn't change much.
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u/Ok-Deal-8479 Minnesota Twins 14d ago
people are either being intentionally disingenuous because the reality sucks and it's more fun to pretend, or they're so damn gullible that you could sell them literally anything lol
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u/derpdeederpa Cole Sands 15d ago
It was a responsible move overall, put us with chance to stay in race and hope to get hot. We weren't a huge splash away from being top contenders, he did what made sense
I will believe it when I see it when it comes to free agency, but I think this Pohlad seems desperate to get fans back in good graces so I'm slightly more optimistic this off-season, looming lockout aside
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u/Hollywood42cards Minnesota Twins 15d ago
I do agree what we did makes sense, and I said as much at the time. But it still doesn't move the needle much in terms of winning me back over
I predict they will add like $20M to payroll on mid-tier veterans and expect to be applauded for it while ignoring that would still be safely below 2023 levels
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u/normalfinnesotan 14d ago
...put us with a chance to stay in a race and hope to get hot.
Are we supposed to be happy about that? He did the bare minimum to give us a fuckin chance to stay in a race, and hope to get hot? Thats the same shit we've been doing for decades , making mild moves at the deadline that aren't going to do a damn thing to actually give us a real, honest shot.
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u/derpdeederpa Cole Sands 13d ago
If you think we should have mortgaged our prospects at the deadline with this core roster to try to make a run at it, I'm not sure what to tell you and also glad you're not in our front office
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u/normalfinnesotan 13d ago
That is not at all what I'm saying. What I am saying is we've seen them do the exact. same. shit. year after year after year, for decades. In case you're not familiar, I'll tell you how this is going to go:
Step 1: They'll put a crappy team on the field
Step 2: They'll ignore fans complaining for a season or two, or however long it takes for the fans to get fed up and stop going to games.
Step 3: Fans quit showing up (i.e. less money for Pohlads)
Step 4: The Pohlad's will say "We're going to invest in the team. We want to bring a championship to the fans of Minnesota."
Step 5: They'll make a half-assed attempt at bringing in talent; one, maybe 2 guys.
Step 6: The team will still suck --> aaaaand we're back to step 1.
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u/NuancedThinker 15d ago
They need to be up to the daunting, formidable challenge of...winning the AL central.
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u/AdoubleyouB Tony Oliva 15d ago
I look forward to a series of underwhelming single year signings of 32 year old players with 1 or 2 years of positive WAR production in their history, and perhaps an aging former star with medical issues that only signs because we can get him for nothing.
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u/HandsomeJack19 15d ago edited 15d ago
"Aggressive" means making offers close enough to say they tried, but just a bit less than other teams offer so they aren't in danger of actually signing anybody of note and having to pay out the contracts.
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u/InfiniteCosmic5 15d ago
No the fuck they won’t lol.
Prove me wrong. Show me. Sign a tier one marque free agent that didn’t cheat or flame out in like 2 seasons.
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u/Ok-Deal-8479 Minnesota Twins 14d ago
At this point we're gonna have to massively, and I mean massively, overpay to trick a top tier free agent into coming here. We've only done it twice, with guys who were available at a discount, and then we completely salary dumped both of them within two seasons.
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u/InfiniteCosmic5 14d ago
And I would be fine with that.
There still isn’t a salary cap, or floor, in MLB and I doubt there ever would be.
That just means the owners can theoretically spend whatever they want on players. Bad for competitive balance, sure. But good for the fans that want star power and the assumed performance that comes with that.
So. I don’t care if they have to overpay. They’re going to raise ticket/broadcasting/concession/merchandise prices on fans anyways.
As a consumer, and not a well off one at that, I’d be ok with paying more for service and or entertainment if the product justified it to me. At current, the product does not.
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u/Ok-Deal-8479 Minnesota Twins 14d ago
oh, I know, I don't care about the Pohlad's money either, just pointing out that it's not gonna be as easy as just signing one, they're gonna have to really go hard and overpay just to get people to consider signing here given our history with big free agents
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u/Champ24NN 15d ago
As long as a Pohlad is running the show, I’m gonna have to see it before I believe it.
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u/milkymanchester 15d ago
Define "meaningful"
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u/LemonSmashy 15d ago
I'm just happy knowing that the Pohlads have not seen a cent off of me since "right size the business". Given what I saw through the season and heard from the press conference that right sizing of my wallet will continue.
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u/ferdsherd 15d ago
Invest in the scouting, analytics, coaching, player dev. Better bang for your buck there
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u/derpdeederpa Cole Sands 15d ago
I recall Joe implied that's what they were doing when right sizing our roster budget and haven't heard any evidence he wasn't simply shitting out of his mouth
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u/troyofmtsthelen 15d ago
Torres, Goldschmidt, Grisham, Gary Sanchez on a bunch of 1 year prove it deals.
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u/Him2Notorious 15d ago edited 15d ago
I think they'll be back at $130m.
But the question is how they reach that. If they re-sign Jeffers on the QO/long term is that meaningful investment? To me? No.
I'm looking at SP and 1B/OF bat
Grisham and Nick Martinez feel very Twinsy
I'd also be looking at our farm. Gonzalez, Rodriguez, Tait. Can you get something big for a good prospect?
If you think about Bell, Jeffers, Ober and Larnach likely out. Even getting to $130m you're looking at A LOT of room
If you are making the call to keep Joe Ryan. You better make sure you are suitably pushing chips in
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u/haros1985 15d ago
They believe there is going to be a hard cap and salary floor.
That's why he's saying this.
It will prove to be true but the Twins will just be a team barely over the salary floor going forward.
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u/Lumiafan Joe Mauer 15d ago
OK, Tom. You're on the record multiple times, and you at least showed us you cared enough to invest a little in the team at this year's deadline. Time to make good on all those promises!
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u/JDmowerman55 15d ago
Prove it bud. They don't need big names, but get guys who are decent instead of signing a bunch of veteran minimum deals
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u/FCMadmin 15d ago
Sounds like the deadline rhetoric...how'd that work out?
The future might be bright if we stop deluding ourselves about the present. This is transparent pandering.
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u/No-Sprinkles8676 15d ago
He is only saying that because there will likely be a lockout in December.
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u/Ok_Catch_7064 15d ago
Listening to this same speech from a different Pohlad is getting extremely old. We will do the bare minimum is the truth. I hope this lockout does bring a true salary cap or something. Force owners to sell to owners that want to OWN a baseball team and participate
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u/The_Next_Wild_GM 15d ago
I assume this means the team will sign 2 starting pitchers coming off Tommy John surgery, this off season. With a chance that they might may play sometime during the season
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u/Worldly-Rice-1947 15d ago
cool can we get pitchers, and spend something on pitching coaches too because that shi was ridiculous
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u/mncabinman 15d ago
There’s not going to be any MLB baseball in 2027 so he has a lot of time before needing to put a product on the field
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u/WannabeReinaMain LaTroy Hawkins 15d ago
It's gotta be at least 150 in 2027, which would still fall short of our 2023 payroll, or i will consider this statement to be unequivocally false.
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u/InsideMyScars 15d ago
One Teruaki Sato please and thank you
But really I’ll be ecstatic with a healthy Pablo back, a 1B/OF/DH bat like Jake Bauers, and at least one elite reliever like Iglesias or Munoz plus another middle relief arm
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u/LemonSmashy 15d ago
I'm just happy knowing that the Pohlads have not seen a cent off of my since "right size the business" and given what i heard fro the press conference that right sizing of my wallet will continue.
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u/sitewolf 14d ago
Meaningful = overpay to keep Jeffers and Ryan and add a back of the pen arm.
How soon is it the young guys start costing bigger money?
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u/Budget-Day-3403 14d ago
Ok, well, the Giants’ are willing to trade Rafael Devers and our 2nd greatest need offensively is to upgrade 1B. He’s making $31M/season for the next 6 seasons which would make him 36 at the end of the deal. Also, Boston is covering $2M/season of that contract and you could probably have SF cover a little bit more depending on which prospects you’re willing to trade. Finally, the Twins have a glut of OF’s and that’s exactly what SF needs. This could also be a destination for Lewis, Ober, Larnach, Wallner, Roden, etc. Time to put your money where your mouth is Tom!
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u/normalfinnesotan 14d ago
Just sell the frickin' team, Tom . You Pohlads have been saying this same shit for decades, nothing ever changes. SELL. THE. TEAM.
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u/Juice-ManJerry 10d ago
Cute platitude but this isn’t exactly the strongest free agent cycle so tom already found his out
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u/Sir_Stash Brad Radke 15d ago
I'm just saying that I'd be willing to join the team on a one year prove it deal. I'm sure my 40+ year old self would be a better investment than half the players they're looking at.
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u/MartianKingMN 15d ago
I think the Pohlads should ask for money for a new stadium. That'll whip up support for the team. /s
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u/Physical-Lettuce-868 Torii Hunter 15d ago
Based on needs, there isn’t much out there to go hard for so….yeah, sure
Edit: where I think the needs are: C, 1B, 2B, BP
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u/McBirdman99 15d ago
The Twins were 7th in runs scored per game and Slugging percentage.
Their real needs are: P, P, P, P, P, etc...
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u/Physical-Lettuce-868 Torii Hunter 15d ago
Yes, but was it luck? The Twins are usually terrible with RISP. This time they weren’t. Will it go back to the way it usually is?
I’m pretty much done with Lewis so if they can get a 1B upgrade they should. If you can’t then just keep him. Their best C is a FA (get him back, but probably won’t).
They have no 2B at all unless you make Clemens a full time starter or Keaschall miraculously learns how to play D there.
Once Houston comes up 2B can be solved by Culpepper, but we don’t know when that will be.
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u/McBirdman99 15d ago edited 15d ago
I'm with you on Royce. It's time to move on. He's a below-average player. I'd rather have Bell back at 1b.
The Twins had a handful of guys with a + 100 OPS+. They need to keep/resign all of them. Larnach, Keaschall, Lee, Culpepper, Clemens, Bell, Buxton, Jeffers...
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u/Physical-Lettuce-868 Torii Hunter 15d ago
I was all for giving him time but 2.5-3 seasons of pretty much nothing is more than enough chances.
I’d be happy with extensions for Keaschall, Culpepper, Bradley and Jenkins. Others I would probably wait on
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u/chpr1jp Minnesota Twins 15d ago
The easiest solution would be for the Pohlads to move the team to a world-class city, with a top-tier media market.
The type of town that is appealing to healthy young millionaires.
Twins players could get all the women and endorsement contracts of which they could dream!
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u/slowwrench 15d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/UTm86phGUMMQE