Trump just called for Congress to abolish the income tax.

[u/Bignblk]

Thoughts???

[u/Hammer_the_Red2]

Must be really desperate to throw out an idea that would require passage by 2/3 in both the House and Senate and then getting 38 states to also pass this amendment. With the way this country is so divided, we will probably never see the passage of a new amendment in our lifetimes.

[u/lopsided-earlobe → u/Hammer_the_Red2]

That would not be required lol

[u/FreedomCanadian → u/lopsided-earlobe]

If anything, they could lower the tax rate to 0% much more easily than this.

[u/Suspicious-Cell5989 → u/lopsided-earlobe]

It's 2/3rds to propose a new amendment and 3/4s of states, aka 38 to ratify. So uh, yes, it would.

[u/lopsided-earlobe → u/Suspicious-Cell5989]

He’s not talking about a constitutional amendment to permanently ban is he?

Congress could simply not levy income tax with a simple majority

[u/Suspicious-Cell5989 → u/lopsided-earlobe]

Income tax is an amendment and unless the amendment has something baked in to remove it, there is no actual "repeal" option

[u/Connect-Blacksmith99 → u/Suspicious-Cell5989]

Income tax is not an amendment, the power to lay and collect an income tax without apportioning it among the states is the 16th. Congress can choose not to use a power. In fact, there were 242 days that congress had the power but there was not yet a law establishing income tax.

The power is used in 26 U.S.C. Anything in the US Code, aside from some of the stuff in the organic laws, can be stricken, as is granted in Article 1 Section 7 of the constitution.

If congress was forced to use every power grandes to them we’d constantly have declared war and mobilized militias, I mean do we, but this would mean we need to!

[u/Suspicious-Cell5989 → u/Connect-Blacksmith99]

Federal income tax is the 16th amendment.

Source: the constitution.

[u/Connect-Blacksmith99 → u/Suspicious-Cell5989]

Wow this is a dumb argument.

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

SHALL HAVE POWER. Not must. And this didn’t even give them the power really - just that they could do it without the apportionment clause applying.

If it was required that congress impose an income tax the text would read “The Congress shall lay and collect…”

[u/Suspicious-Cell5989 → u/Connect-Blacksmith99]

Where exactly did I say they MUST, you are the one that turned this into a weird semantic argument.

Anyways, good luck out there!

[u/Connect-Blacksmith99 → u/Suspicious-Cell5989]

You said “Income tax is an amendment” and seem to be arguing that “there is no actual repeal option”.

I’m arguing that congress could take affirmative action to repeal U.S.C. 26, thereby abolishing income tax.

It’s the fucking constitution - it’s all semantics.

[u/pakapab → u/lopsided-earlobe]

It wouldn't even take congress, Trump would try to do it with executive order and a compliant IRS.

[u/Suspicious-Cell5989 → u/pakapab]

I mean, trump has made it clear he will do whatever he wants regardless of the law. But legally speaking that would not be legal. Again, at least typically.

[u/Connect-Blacksmith99 → u/pakapab]

Eh, that would be difficult. The tax and its thresholds are set in the U.S.C. The best bet would be to adopt some very liberal interpretations of the deduction rules - but these would likely be challenged in court.

Alternatively they could stop enforcing the payment of income tax, communicate this, and issue a blanket pardon to the entire population, but he would have to do this on the last day and income tax would effectively be reinstated in the next administration.

In a fun twist he could theoretically only pardon red states

[u/Hammer_the_Red2 → u/lopsided-earlobe]

For the Federal Income Tax? Sure, if they decided to set the tax rate to 0% per citizen they could avoid a new amendment. However, that wouldn't stop the next Congress from raising it. The only way to permentantly remove the federal income tax is to amend the constitution removing the 16th amendment.

[u/Raintitan → u/Hammer_the_Red2]

I agree unless a 9/11 or equally horrible thing happens. The reaction to these things is usually too far, but that's the level of scenario I think would be needed and even then I would bet in what you are saying. Not in our lifetimes.