First copper pot

[u/Remarkable_Corgi511]

I just got my first copper saucepan for ~$70. It's not the best thing in the world, and I didn't expect it to have a rolled edge. The listing photos on ebay didn't really have a clear view of it from the side without the lid on. I have calipers, but I don't know how to measure the thickness of the copper below the rolled edge. I don't really have the best eye for this sort of stuff but the tin lining looks okay, I do see a bit of red coming through, not sure if that's just dirt or exposed copper. The bottom mark is mostly worn away, but it says that it is made in Italy. What do you think? Maybe it just needs a good wash?

[u/kwillich]

I'd return it. It's not worth $70.

[u/Senior_Spinach7089 → u/kwillich]

★ Apologizing FIRST for this long post to follow 🙏 ray. NO NEED to read if NOT interested about feedback regarding OP's pot purchase 🙅‍♂️. Apologizing first for those who WILL comment something nasty about this/my lengthy comment 🥵

I agree 🤝. $70 for a TAGUS thin copper pan is WAYYYY TOO MUCH ❌️

However? OP says she can read a marking of made in Italy? I don't SEE that in pics, NOR can I make out a Tagus Logo?

I cannot discern condition of the tin 2B unsuitable from pics, as I see another expressed? From what I can see, tin looks FINE ? lF tin intact, then it CAN BE USED w/out concern. If not ? I'd NOT risk it 👎

Lastly, as an AVID Antique & Vintage Copper (& Cast Iron) Cookware Collector of many years whom has a collection which CURRENTLY numbers OVER 2K¹, I DON'T see the most important piece of info one SHOULD have in deciding value of a copper cookware vessel (in addition to condition of interior lining): THAT BEING WEIGHT OF THE VESSEL relative to its size? 👁👁

Therefore ❓️ IF OP made this post wanting feedback/opinions: I'd advise to provide the following info: ● quart capacity ● weight

👉 IF the interior lining IS NOT INTACT❓️ Regardless of price paid, I'd return it w/the reason being damaged lining renders vessel unusable & not disclosed in listing ✔️ .... bcuz the cost of restoring the lining will likely FAR exceed value of the vessel

IF lining IS intact & vessel usable? THEN? I'd decide whether or not to keep depending on its size/weight. From pics, it appears 2B @ least 2qts whilst <4qts? If thats the case, personally, I'd NOT KEEP unless the piece weighed AT LEAST 3LBS .... but thats ME 🙄 . tbh, personally DON'T USE copper pots/saucepans that are 4qts & under that are LESS THAN 3mm thick & substantial in weight. In fact? Altho I've >10 full sets of saucepans in my inventory, for personal use, I keep four different FULL SETS of saucepans on various displays throughout my kitchen, dining & foyer areas for use & OF THOSE 4 sets ONLY ONE SET is 3mm thick & the others are 4mm & 5mm thick.

Oh wait❗️ Actually, I DO have out/use a set that is 2mm thick: I've a weird set of 7 various vessels - NOT necessarily just a set of graduated saucepans that I believe are 2mm 🤔 💭❓️ Those are a Lidded group of 7 vessels made by Georg Jensen but are Sterling lined. Altho I've a good amount of various Sterling Lined Solid Copper Cookware (& servingware), THAT set has the most number of MATCHING pieces (gulp)

Anyhoo ❓️ It ought go w/out saying, I LEARNED A LOT from when I too, FIRST became interested IN & sought to ACQUIRE solid copper cookware for myself. As with most things, due to HUGE investments of time & money, I've gained a certain wisdom regarding PURCHASES as a direct result of a couple decades of experience as an AVID hunter of some of THE FINEST copper (& cast iron) cookware MADE - from ALL OVER the globe 😉

So, MY advice here comes from a place of ONLY GOOD INTENTIONS hoping to lend insight I wish I HAD when I first began acquiring copper cookware ✋️. Altho $70 may NOT sound or BE much of a financial cost to many, I certainly percieve $70 2B a healthy enuf chunk o change that DESERVES the acquisition of a DECENT piece of cookware that ought be suitable for use & NOT simply a decorative piece. For $70, I KNOW what I'm CAPABLE OF GETTING in terms of a first (practical) piece of copper cookware. In fact , I JUST NOW spent 8 minutes perusing 'the bay' & found a WONDERFUL 3mm thick, hammered, fully intact tin lined ~2.5-3qt, solid copper saucepan with cast iron handle, copper rivets AND WEIGHT of the vessel seen in pic on a scale shows a HEFTY 4lbs 11oz 👉 Now THATSA NIIIICE pan 👌 ❗️ Messaged seller asking if they'd accept an $80 offer on the item listed at $99 & seller responded they'd accept $85. FREE Shipping on the listing. So the transaction would ultimately cost total of $90.01 w/6% FL State tax & including shipping

Granted, THIS ROUTE poses perhaps a $15 difference in price (?), unsure as OP didn't disclose total price paid w/tax & shipping .... but the QUALITY & PRACTICALITY of the vessel is a no-brainer ✔️

To the OP: ur vessel may well BE indeed a GOOD piece worth what you've invested 👍. Pls kno I'm NOT expressing otherwise here 🙅‍♀️. I'm only expressing such being difficult to determine FOR ME ? IF you'd be interested in better feedback, maybe consider providing just a lil more info❓️ ALSO❓️ IF looking to acquire add'l pieces of copper cookware &/or help searching out such, feel free to DM me here & I'm happy to help ✋️. I NO LONGER hunt cookware as I used to bcuz God KNOWS I do not NEED 1 more piece of ANY TYPE OF COOKWARE ... plus, I've re-focused ALL my hunting the last couple yrs on my fragrance collection which now ALSO numbers almost 2K, lol. Still tho: am happy to help others - should one desire the help - in THEIR pursuit or goal building their own practical & useful cookware of the oh-so-lovely copper type 🙄 as I HATE 2C or hear of OTHERS making some of the mistakes I unfortunately made when I first began 😐. Also? Am gearing up to do a SERIOUS downsizing/selling off of most of MY OWN cookware inventory that I have beyond the maybe 15% I'll be keeping. So maybe I'd have something being sought .... or even if just wanting some insight on a piece listed somewhere 💁‍♀️❓️

Again, I'm around & happy to help - if interested

Blessings 🙌🏼 to ALL along their journey & ESPEC to those HERE along their copper cookware journey: whether in pursuit OF or interest IN it🙏

¹ Please note: the (frankly ridiculous) size of my collection is NOT shared in ANY light or sense of "bragging" whatsoever 🙅‍♀️. Rather, ONLY intending to explain having direct knowledge/experience regarding specific forms/types of quality features, etc across the varied eras & manufacturers of (generally) higher end Solid Copper Cookware. In fact, MY having 2100 pieces of Solid Copper Cookware is anything BUT bragging, bcuz unfortunately, it appears I acquired as a means of coping thru certain severely traumatic events 😔. I'm a bit of what most recognize as a "nerd" ✋️ & never one to like OR DO other more common forms of unhealthy human "coping" behaviors such as drugs, drinking, gambling, promiscuity, etc ..... seems MY way of coping showed up in my "filling holes WITH STUFF" . . . solid copper &/or cast iron cookware kinds of stuff 2B exact. Sighhh 🥵. Tho I NO LONGER engage IN hunting cookware for personal acquisition (& only to assist others & friends/family - when asked), I DO STILL interact w/others whom enjoy & appreciate to share knowledge, pics, etc 😊

[u/Senior_Spinach7089 → u/Senior_Spinach7089]

Oh, I should've also said: I've a few pieces that look VERY similar to the the pic listed. The Italian made pots I HAVE w/same lid & rolled lip ARE PURTY HEAVY and IF this pot - looks 2B a mid sized Polenta vessel (?) - is similar to those I have ? Such as those I've got that are similar, for that size pictured, are about 4lbs or so? IF thats what YOU HAVE HERE (?), THEN, for $70 ? OH HECK YES, you've DONE GREAT ✔️ & KUDOS 2U 👏🏽 👏🏽 👏🏽 😄

Again tho: altho I DON'T really SEE anything major wrong with the tin - when I zoom in- MIGHT LOOK as tho the tin IS WEARING & copper might be peeking thru on a couple hammered areas maybe (?) 👉 & THATS ONE OF the deciding factors: condition of the tin AND weight. IF the copper IS INDEED peeking thru ???? .... THEN .... well .... yeah, I WOULD prolly either return it OR be EXTREMELY CAREFUL to use ONLY silicone utensils AND NO ACIDIC FOODS cooking maybe ? IF its a heavy piece (?), I dunno how YOU feel about keeping but being ESPECIALLY ATTENTIVE/CAREFUL using bcuz you might NOT have much time B4 re-tinning will be REQUIRED 🙄 .

ME ? IF that IS even the tiny-est bit of copper showing thru ? Yeah, I'd return it .... bcuz for $70 .... maybe with a few MORE dollars ... look, YOU CAN GET a FAR BETTER piece which can be used w/out worry/concern & HAVE for a LONGGG time w/out needing tin restoration. For that same or near same price range: its NOT THAT DIFFICULT to find a MUCH BETTER vessel that maybe is just not QUITE as LARGE. For a vessel of the same size with at LEAST a weight of 4lbs ... up to even 7lbs, it might or could take some deeper diving or patience, BUT TRUST ME ✋️, there ARE listings out there around $100 - $125 ✔️..... the end result is a piece you DON'T have to worry about using .... that'll last YOUR LIFETIME & longer .... & not necessarily require re-tinning 😉¹

¹ Whilst many believe ALL tin lined copper cookware to eventually require re-tinning, that is simply NOT TRUE. Re-tinning is completely dependent upon several factors such as thickness of the applied tin to begin with, the frequency & manner of USE & CARE OF the vessel by those whom use it, type(s) of foods cooked IN it, etc .....

For example: I've GOT a graduated set of 7 hammered 4mm Matfer Bourgeat saucepans that were used (often) by my grandmother. My mom inherited, displayed and used, albeit NOT very often, maybe 10 times/year for wach pan. I've had now 20yrs and they're workhorses ! I use them weekly: the largest 3 vessels more than the others. 2yrs ago, I brought to Jim at East Coast Tinning to look at bcuz it had been several DECADES by then & even HE told me tin was STILL FINE in ALL PANS ✔️ Thus, even IF one might agree on tin needing 2B replaced "eventually" .... that time might NOT be in YOUR Lifetime 😉 LOL

[u/Remarkable_Corgi511 → u/kwillich]

The seller doesn't accept returns

[u/Narraismean]

Tagus, Portugal. That's the pattern on the bottom. It's probably 1 mm -1.2 mm thick do the curl lip gives it structural integrity. Excellent for boiling. Don't give it big swings in temperatures. Always have something in it before turning on gas. Nice pot.

[u/Remarkable_Corgi511 → u/Narraismean]

Thank you! 

[u/Narraismean → u/Remarkable_Corgi511]

Having read the remarks, it may well be Italian 😃. I asked AI which remains obdurate. Tbh unless I see a stamp saying (made in ****) then you just don't know where it's from.

If you purchased it on Ebay you may be able to dispute it regardless of sellers terms.

There are though a good number of brands which people look for. Mauviel, E. Dehellerin, Gaillard, Tornus, Fabrication Francaise. Leon Jaeggi & sons (Helvetia). There are others. Ask Google. It will always have an opinion.

Additionally what people look for is the thickness of the pan, casserole etc. A professional kitchen would have something built to last and 3mm + are common items from restaurants.

Modern items are a lot thinner and lined with stainless. 2.5mm is probably the sweet spot. So .5 mm either side should provide you with a good pot that you can use.

But thicker is OK if you can handle the weight or it's a bargain price.

As for the linings many stainless ones are both Modern and vintage because this became common in the 1970s. As for your pan unless you can see copper then it's ok. Certainly doesn't appear to be any.

Copper pans with zero lining are common often Jam boilers are such. Also professional chefs would boil sugar and make caramel in a copper pan. So you will see examples. Or it may just need re-lining. Acidic foods and copper don't go well together.

Cost. I live in UK and some of the prices in America reflect the richest economy in the world i.e expensive. Some sellers particularly on Ebay will happily ship items anywhere and is usually in their listing. And look for sellers who have 100% positive reputations or very close to.

[u/Akhael17]

It needs to be re tinned but I think it’s nice

[u/Remarkable_Corgi511 → u/Akhael17]

It might not be worth it for me to retin it if it costs more than the pot itself... It doesn't look too bad to me yet, is it OK if I don't cook with anything acidic in it? 

[u/Akhael17 → u/Remarkable_Corgi511]

I don’t know the specifics (I have copper stainless steel) I just know when the copper is showing through it needs to be redone. If you can find something local it might not be expensive at all