r/ChemicalEngineering • u/DullConstruction1727 • 19h ago
Research Pattern in the Industry
I’ve noticed this pattern in the industry where technicians hate on engineers, and engineers with Bachelor’s degree hate on those with PhD. I’d say the latter is more common in my experience. Why’s that the case?
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u/brasssica 19h ago
The stereotypes is that people with more academic training have less practical knowledge. It's not always true, but of course you do come across cases of PhDs who don't know which way to hold a wrench. And it's hella annoying when someone without the relevant practical knowledge is an position of higher status/power/income/whatever.
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u/speed-of-sound 7h ago
I work in an area that always has abundant engineers from one of the top top ChemE programs and everyone absolutely rags on them for that reason. They can probably beat everyone at a math test, but if you need to make eye contact and use a tool it’s incredibly painful to watch lmao.
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u/Accurate-Bullfrog324 19h ago
you must be working in a corrupt corporate culture. being disrespectful of others is not allowed in a good company
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u/DullConstruction1727 19h ago
I guess, but I’m not sure this is specific to my industry as I’ve heard a lot of reservations particularly against engineers with PhDs.
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u/Necessary_Occasion77 19h ago
Engineers with PhDs often find themselves in roles that are very separated from the process. They don’t get the hands on experience. Then make recommendations for an improvement project without knowing the basics and then it fails to deliver.
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u/Final_Significance72 18h ago
lol. As a PhD in chem engineering… it was kind of clear to me that this was possible pitfall/ pattern for traditional cush chem eng jobs available to me fresh out of grad school. For better or worse.. i kind of steered away from it.
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u/owera1211 18h ago
This is typical work dynamic in a disjointed group. It is easier to hate on others when you do not understand them. A cohesive groups can communicate better to cover this gap.
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u/Gu0se 12h ago
its the factory/plant youre working in. Ive worked as a Operator during my bachelors. In my first factory working was awesome, sure you had some people you didnt get along with to well but you have that pretty much everywhere. But overall the vibe in that place was that everybody had love and appreciation for the "game".
The factory i worked in during the end of my studies over half the people working there were somehow stuck in a weird mindset of not even wanting to do the smallest amount of work, cinstantly getting pissed at coworker for "leaving" them work, just very toxic enviroment.
2nd place also had a high turnover for all people working there. Its just that the toxic fuckers seem to never leave.
So there are definetly workplaces out there where you have a nice work experience. I just think that if a workplace turns toxic at some point you need a small miracle to turn it healthy again. No idea how that miracle would look tho
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u/SOwED 15h ago
In which industry specifically haha
I've of course seen operators and technicians complaining about engineers for talking down to them, engineers complaining about operators and technicians for not following SOPs or extremely clear instructions, but I have not seen much of the PhD stuff you're talking about.
My career has largely been R&D and pilot scale so I will say as I get older, as someone with a bachelors, there is coming a kind of change in how I view PhDs who are younger than me. They often are overconfident and kind of think they can't be wrong when it comes to research. Older PhDs are great resources, but if I've been doing industry research since you were in undergrad, the things your PhD does for you that I don't have are typically on the narrower side.
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u/Which_Throat7535 11h ago
Why do you think that’s the case? You’d have more insight into your team culture and dynamic than we do….
I’ve been in industry 17 years and this has never been my experience. My team (technicians and engineers) gets work direction primarily from researchers with PhDs (some with masters) and it’s quite functional and amicable. I’m sure there is some minor friction or grumbling from time to time but I’m confident “hate” is not part of the equation.
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u/Commercial-Gas2215 8h ago
I’m venting a bit when I say this, but I’ve worked at 5 different plants in 5 different areas of the country and different industries. These people (operators) absolutely hate their lives. The type of people who suck the soul out of you. This line of work is not for the weak or if you don’t have thick skin. That being said, as for operators hating engineers, all you can do is let your work do the talking and know a lot of these folks are very stubborn and adverse to change. Getting buy in from operators on projects is an art they don’t teach in school, but is learned over time. Pretty jaded by all of it tbh given my experiences with operators but it is what it is.
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u/jwalter_19 Ops Eng/ Ops Manager 8h ago
Coming from experience as an operator to engineer, I can easily say it's because the engineer didn't take into account operations input. They'll design a fix/upgrade which would be an operations and maintenance nightmare. When these additional problems are brought up the engineer will get indignant from pride.
This is an easy fix. Engage operations from the start of the project concept. Additional don't take design criticism too much to heart. In the end everyone will win when a solution is successful.
As for BS and PhD friction, I haven't had much experience in that. I've (BS) learned a lot from PhD'd engineers in my interactions. Most of them also understood their place as being a highly technical resource and left the regular operations to me. Honestly again pride is usually where things get difficult.
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u/yellownumbersix Membranes and polymers, 22yrs 8h ago
That isn't the case in my experience.
It comes down to company culture which is not universal, maybe you have only worked in toxic environments.
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u/Zetavu 7h ago
Technicians hate being treated like technicians specifically if they have experience and know the process better than most green engineers, and everyone hares most pHd's because the majority are lazy entitled chair sitters that expect everyone else to do their work for them.
The reality? Technicians are either trained off the street or somekne with a lessor degree (BA focused on science) or a BS from a lower regarded school that could bot get a higher job. Some are waiting for an opportunity that likely is not coming, others just want a paycheck.
BS engineers are the bulk of the industry and smart ones get their MBA and move into leadership. PHDs rarely move up as they lack business acumen and typically have terrible people skills. Not just my impression, this is after 40 years of industry observation.
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u/dietdrpepper6000 7h ago
The operator-engineer dynamic is real & culture-dependent. Have never noticed BS-PhD animosity though, personally.
Imo, the operator-engineer dynamic comes down to techs/operators feeling like these overpaid know-it-alls doling out work for them which doesn’t always make sense, and often if it doesn’t work, it will be blamed on them. So from their perspective, they do all the real work to try and fit these square pegs in round holes while some business casual mfs chill in their air conditioned office.
Meanwhile, the engineers are wondering why there is so much hostility from the operators when they’re only asking them to do their job.
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u/beefcakez 6h ago
I don't think this is universally true, but I can speak to a perception I once had. There was a time when I felt that many PhDs lacked the practical understanding of how things actually work in an industrial environment.
I still think there's some truth to that, particularly among those who went straight into academia without ever spending meaningful time in industry. Spending 15 years in an academic environment doesn't necessarily translate into understanding real-world processes, production constraints, or the challenges faced by those actually doing the work. Yet some enter industry expecting their credentials alone to command respect.
The PhDs I've respected most are those who spent years in the trenches before pursuing their doctorate. They bring both practical experience and advanced technical knowledge to the table.
Ultimately, I respect competence, humility, and experience far more than the letters after someone's name. A PhD can be incredibly valuable, but it doesn't automatically make someone more knowledgeable about every aspect of engineering.
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u/HaloNevermore 11h ago
Because PhDs generally look down on regular floor workers and infer they know more due to their education.
Then walk five feet, bang their bare head on a safety sign that says “HARD HAT AREA”, which then costs the company on its safety KPI.
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u/NanoWarrior26 19h ago
I used to work in paper and I loved the PhDs. They actually liked to chat about how to fix or improve things. Besides it was fun when they had ideas and I would go that would never work here made me feel like the operators when I talked to them lol.