r/pcmasterrace • u/Wargulf • 28d ago

News/Article PS5 Linux lead quits as open-source projects have become “a bunch of noobs using LLMs” that “they don’t even understand”

https://frvr.com/blog/news/ps5-linux-lead-quits-as-open-source-projects-have-become-a-bunch-of-noobs-using-llms-that-they-dont-even-understand/
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181

u/NvidiatrollXB1 28d ago

I'm gonna use that one. Did ai tell you that? Heh.

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u/PinkyPonk10 28d ago

lol. I never accept an answer from AI without asking it to supply the full chain of reasoning including references.

Sometimes it provides them and we are good.

Sometimes though it just collapses and says “oh sorry now you are pushing back I’ve realised I assumed x or y without any evidence”

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u/-Aeryn- Specs/Imgur here 28d ago edited 28d ago

I asked GPT 5.6 a yes/no question about a popular franchise recently and it was so violently wrong that it spent about 8 paragraphs correcting the answer that it made up, and correcting the correction that were still wrong before it eventually stumbled onto the correct answer.

It cited reference links. They did not contain the information that GPT5.6 said that they did.

This has happened to me many times. People keep telling me that LLM's can answer questions like this, i give it a spin because it's been a couple of months, and they reliably fall onto their face immediately.

If i didn't know the correct answer beyond a doubt before asking the question, the tool would have been much worse than useless. If i did, why ask it? LLM's are fundamentally unable to do this job with reasonable quality (and many others like it).

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u/spoo4brains 28d ago

LLM's being confidently incorrect is the biggest problem. If you know something on a subject, you can catch it out when it is talking shit, but with people who just outsource their brain they just take anything it says as gospel.

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u/mxzf 28d ago

You say "the biggest problem" as if it's not the fundamental nature of an LLM. That's their whole purpose, to spit out a plausible-sounding response, regardless of any "correctness" metrics.

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u/spoo4brains 28d ago

The problem is the people who don't know that when they use AI.

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u/WhenInZone 28d ago

This is the problem too. AI doesn't truly have the ability to cite anything. It generates expected text. It cannot be graded on accuracy because that would be like grading a hammer on its ability to twist screws.

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u/Strange_Dust7128 28d ago

depends on the harness. agy or even just the gemini webpage cite sources all the time, and synthesize responses from those sources.

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u/LivingVerinarian96 28d ago

Gpt 5.6 usually also cites the correct information. But I also noticed it citing completely wrong stuff and messing up the citation itself. It‘s even worse when you got like 15 files uploaded in a chat, trying to compare them to each other. The citations are just random ascii bullshit and it can‘t get it right anymore even if you complain. But for basic internet research it‘s usually fine. I use it A LOT at work.

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u/Strange_Dust7128 28d ago

That’s really interesting, and I wonder if that has anything to do with the new model. I tend to use GPT5.6 sol for a lot of work, and alternate models. MiniMax is my go to for side projects, mostly research. I use goose as my harness so I wonder if that contributes at all to the problem

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u/LivingVerinarian96 28d ago

Maybe, but the model has the same problem with the official openAI harness, so it‘s probably at least 70% the model and maybe 30% the harness.

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u/PratzStrike STEAM_0:0:13265632 28d ago

https://i.imgur.com/GFvI6sz.jpeg

I asked AI one simple question recently...

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u/Turlututu1 28d ago

When I was in the process of ordering a custom guitar, I asked an AI about a particular feature I wasn't sure about (whether radius x or y was better for a fanned fret guitar). Because I didn't find information online about whether or not that was good or not. It started by straight up saying option b is great, then went on about citing physics with how the tension for the strings would be better etc etc etc... as I presses on whether its info/decision was taking into account that was for a 6 string and not a 7, it still kept saying that it's perfect, until it then stopped when I asked for examples of models or makers that used option y. It then told me I should rather ask the builder.

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u/ContactRepulsive 28d ago

What was the question?

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u/-Aeryn- Specs/Imgur here 28d ago edited 28d ago

"Is <character name> in <book series>?"

The answer was "No." There is no character by that name which is ever mentioned even a single time in the books, but gpt 5.6 said yes. It correctly identified the book series, and invented the character and lore-fitting backstory to sound like it would plausibly fit in.

When pressed it said that it had to correct the previous message and they actually had a more minor role.

When pressed again it said that it had to correct the correction and they're actually not in the book at all.

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u/FemaleMishap 28d ago

My experience would then say that the character you were asking about is actually the main character of the series.

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u/Hopenightdev 28d ago

They humanize how an LLM generates text so that when you're frustrated you end up teaching them. Correcting an llm is effectively becoming an employee and helping with future responses.

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u/ItalianDragon R9 5950X / XFX 6900XT / 64GB DDR4 3200Mhz 28d ago

This is exactly why LLMs should never be used regardless of setting and not even for the most basic tasks. If it can't even get the most bog standard stuff right, why should it be trusted for more complex stuff ? You're just asking for trouble if you do so.

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u/os_beef 28d ago edited 28d ago

You need to set rules for the model to follow, such as what type of sources to prefer, how and when to cite sources, etc. Not all models or effort levels will produce the same results either. Some models will just make shit up (every current Gemini model), others are more meticulous (Claude Code), but how you build your prompt matters tremendously. They're machines, not magic.

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u/HSLB66 28d ago

Being able to understand when your LLM is off the rails is critical. But that’s why I also only give it well defined problems and am very picky about my context. 

“Build app no mistakes” is a real problem 

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u/Chapter-Legitimate 28d ago

I just have it start spitting reference links to me so I can read up and learn for myself. Something few people bother to do.

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u/CelebrationTough1054 28d ago

I think we used to have a tool that did that. It was called Google or something idk

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u/Chapter-Legitimate 28d ago

But Google itself is shit now most of the time. Also I can have AI answer a question with regular language and then spit out the links so I can read more from that context. It's completely different

So yes I do ask AI questions. But I don't stop there and just trust what it says.

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u/Kyousuke11 28d ago

Me thinking that I'm going crazy. I swear i used to be able to use google search to find stuff but now its almost like i need to go ask ai to find me sources and then follow the trail. Maybe I'm remembering wrong...

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u/Chapter-Legitimate 28d ago

For sure Google is worse now

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u/Garbage_Freak_99 28d ago

Ten years ago I know I could get an answer to even highly technical questions in a few minutes at most. Now I have to use a lot of tricks and it will still often spit out the opposite of what I asked, or some of the top results will only search filler words like "the" or a nonsensical string of the words in my query. There used to be a feature where it would somehow find a top answer from Reddit or Wikipedia and quote it at the top of the search results and more often than not it was spot-on, but that seems to have been completely replaced by AI.

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u/HSLB66 28d ago

No it’s way worse. They changed how they index sites and it doesn’t serve information. It serves whatever is most likely to make them ad money

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u/Metallibus 28d ago

Google just shits out Facebook links in response to most queries now. Between Facebook links there are Twitter posts, YouTube videos and a smattering of useless pages that have been SEO gaming and contain nothing of substance.

Then they also gutted all the utilities like graphing and replaced them with the slop box.

Google is almost useless recently. I can't tell if it's just coincidence that it was getting this bad anyway or if it's being made worse intentionally to push Gemini.

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u/lordover1234 28d ago

surely things like -facebook -twitter -instagram “research” still work, right? right??

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u/Kyoshiiku 28d ago

Google isn’t as good as it used to be, multiple reason for that, AI being one of them, for example nobody ask questions on stackoverflow because you have it quicker with an LLM and you don’t have to worry about your question being closed wrongly by someone else.
We end up with all that "documentation" not being created online in forums because of that

Another aspect is the move of multiple communities on Discord or other apps like this, back in the day we had forums which was easy to reference via google, but with the move towards discord those questions and answers for a lot of hobbies or subject are literally just not searchable on the web anymore.

Then on top of having less sources to get information from, we are now at a point where half of first page results of a google query (except for News I guess) are literally AI Slop that reads like GPT 3 quality of output, that is optimized for SEO for making money with ads with mostly wrong information.

At this point using an LLM as a source aggregator is often quicker, better and more precise than Google.
It can find more easily for example the exact documentation you want and the exact paragraph for the exact problem you want instead of having to figure yourself in a really bad unmaintained doc page yourself

Google might as well be just a glorified Reddit search tool, I feel like it’s the only use case I have for it nowadays

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u/Shineplasma64 28d ago

Last time I did that it faked reference links to KB articles about nonexistent powershell libraries

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u/[deleted] 28d ago

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u/Haunting-Vanilla1624 5800X3D | 7900XTX 28d ago

I've got a mechanic buddy. A customer came in the other day with a non-functional AC system. They insisted the shop could fix the AC in her car because chat gpt told her "she could spray R134a into the air to make the car cold".

He tried explaining how that was a very bad idea. She got annoyed then left.

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u/Chapter-Legitimate 28d ago

So you click the links and see if it's real. If it hallucinating the references it will be clear really quickly

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u/Shineplasma64 28d ago

Well, that is how I found out it created the entire solution from whole cloth lmao

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u/TheTresStateArea 28d ago

My work is data science. It's all written procedure in white papers and journals thankfully. When I spin something up I either already know the proper approach or I can have it seed the code with links to source references for reasoning

The real task is the ability to read a shit ton of code and papers. Lord in Adderall save me.

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u/ForensicPathology 28d ago

"Great catch there.  I need to clarify something I said earlier."

How are those things not programmed to check their own output if they can do it after being asked?

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u/PinkyPonk10 28d ago

“Great catch!” Ah yes. Heard that a few too many times.

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u/Haunting-Vanilla1624 5800X3D | 7900XTX 28d ago

I want the devs of these AI models to stop making them act human. If I use one to look for errors (which I never will), don't spit out "oh silly me teehee" wordvomit; just fix the damn thing and give me the output.

This is a big reason I refuse to use these ridiculous chatbots.

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u/Evening_Reach_8293 28d ago

I just use AI to help me dig for references for my work. It's faster than reading 100 abstracts that don't lead anywhere, but in a majority of cases that's what I end up having to do anyway.

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u/KorovasId 28d ago

I've been seeing that more and more when I feed too much info into one prompt. If I ask it to look up 10 things it will look up the first 4 and then make assumptions and general statements about the rest without actually looking at my specific references. I've gone full circle from thinking AI was completely useless to the most important tool of this century, back to thinking its completely useless.

That is unless you hold its hand every step of the way, which ends up taking more time than doing it myself in the first place.

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u/AmItheonlySaneperson 28d ago

Little tip don’t say that to your gf if you wanna coom that day 

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u/NvidiatrollXB1 28d ago

Did ai tell you that?

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u/DreddPirateBob808 28d ago

I'm getting it on a t-shirt