Deep sigh because I know I'm probably going to get downvoted, or worse, for this but here goes nothing.

Dawson's outburst at Pacey and Joey when he discovered they were seeing each other was understandable. His language and tone might not have been okay,he was hypocritical, condescending, and acting way too entitled but his anger was still entirely valid.

I want to clarify: I am not a Dawson fan. I don't really like his character; he's too annoying and constantly refuses to grow up. I was, and still am, the biggest Pacey and Joey supporter. I wanted them to end up together so badly, and I am incredibly happy that they did. But at the same time, I can't pretend it was okay for Pacey and Joey to see each other behind Dawson's back.

He was a 17-year-old boy finding out that his childhood love and ex-girlfriend was dating his closest, most trusted best friend. I would have flipped out too.

Again, I'm not a fan of the specific language he used during the confrontation. He was being irritating and acting like Joey was his property and Pacey was some lackey beneath him. But I can absolutely understand where he was coming from. A lot of people I know in real life and online don't seem to share this opinion with me; they think he was just overreacting and that he shouldn't be entitled to his feelings.

Just because a character frequently does annoying things doesn't mean every single thing they feel or do after that is invalid.I think we are always led to pick a side but not everything is black or white,characters we love and adore can be the A hole to.

I can truly understand where his pain was coming from. Am I completely alone on this?

I know that sounds brutal, but the more I rewatch the show, the more I believe Jen’s death was the wrong ending and Dawson’s would have been the right one.
The central reason is that Dawson never actually lived his life. He tried to script it. He cast himself as the hero, Joey as the leading lady, and Pacey as the sidekick. He had a plan for how everything was supposed to go, and whenever reality refused to follow his screenplay, he fell apart and made everyone around him pay for it. His parents’ divorce didn’t fit the story. His father’s death didn’t fit the story. Joey falling for Pacey didn’t fit the story. And in each of those moments, Dawson didn’t grow, he regressed. He became cruel, self-righteous, and completely incapable of seeing the people he claimed to love as people instead of characters in his own movie. That is not romantic. That is entitlement dressed up as sensitivity. So if the show really wanted to say something meaningful, Dawson’s death would have been the ultimate lesson: you cannot direct life. You cannot rewrite grief, divorce, or someone else’s heart. Life is not a three-act structure, and the people you love are not yours to place in scenes. The message would have been clear and devastating: live your life for what it is, not for what you want it to be, and treat the people around you well while you still have them. Dawson dying would have forced him, and the audience, to confront the fact that he was never in control. It would have been poetic, because the guy who spent the entire series trying to author reality would finally be silenced by it. Jen, by contrast, earned her life. She had far more need of a future than of a tragic function. She arrived in Capeside with a complicated past, a reputation that preceded her, and a struggle to find her place. Her journey was about overcoming the judgment of others and defining herself beyond her mistakes. Killing her risks reducing her story, in retrospect, to that of a young woman destined to suffer so that others could grow. She had a concrete future , she was a mother. She wasn’t just an adolescent searching for identity , she was an adult responsible for another human being. Letting her live would have allowed us to see what she would have done with the maturity she had earned. She started as the girl everyone judged and slut-shamed, the one who was supposed to be the cautionary tale. But she grew. She evolved. She rebuilt her relationship with Grams, she became a mother to Amy, she created a real family with Jack, and she chose kindness again and again even when the world gave her no reason to. Her death was gratuitous. It felt like the show punishing the girl who dared to have a past. It was the classic “tragic woman” trope. She deserved to live. She deserved to raise Amy. She deserved a future. And then there is the shadow Dawson always cast over Joey and Pacey. Even when Joey chose Pacey, Dawson was still there, looming over them. The guilt, the nostalgia, the need for permission, the feeling that their love was somehow a betrayal. If Dawson had died, that shadow would have changed. It would have become grief instead of a rival. Joey would have been forced to face a world without Dawson, and she would have realized that life does go on. But she also would have realized that she could not imagine her life without Pacey. That is the distinction she spent years refusing to make: friendly love versus romantic love. With Dawson gone, she would have had to make it. She would have understood, earlier and more clearly, that what she felt for Dawson was affection , STABILITY , history, comfort, and guilt, not the kind of love that builds a future. What she felt for Pacey was the real thing .

Because looking back they didn’t really do a good job trying to convince u that he was a better option. To be honest with u I feel bad for the shippers because they really did get cheated their ship didn’t get a fair shot it always worked in Joey & Pacey’s favor.

Is it sad that my comfort seasons are 1-3 then when it comes to the rest there are only a handful of episodes i watch but for the most part i skip around the next 3 seasons.

In “Clean & Sober” Joey is talking about how every man leaves her because she isn’t good enough. Pacey says the line “Maybe you’re so amazing u make them want to be better” I wonder if he was alluding to himself?

It’s so insane to me that all of season 5 Joey & Pacey didn’t talk about their relationship at all then all of sudden in season 6 Pacey is annoyed that Joey didn’t grieve the relationship & wasn’t more jealous of his dates. Like first of all where was this in season 5 & secondly Pacey u dated her room mate u didn’t seem that broken up about it either.

I just found out that the original ending was supposed to be season 6 episode 22 but they added two more episodes because im guessing people hated it, including me. Can u imagine sitting thru this intense love triangle for 6 years and she chose herself forget that im so happy it got rejected and they tried again. The thing I hate the most is nobody found out she left we didn’t see anybody reacting to her leaving not even the boys. 🙄

Notoriously , I have a lot of opinions on this show. And I feel like with every rewatch I have more.

Currently I’m on season 6 episode 4 instant karma. Eddie (blahhh 🙄) makes a comment to Joey about a book she’s reading asking isn’t the paper on that due Monday ?

I’m sorry but how did she manage to be salutatorian and manage to get into Worthington when she was always doing everything last minute and always late to her college classes ? I understand it’s her underdog story but make it believable.

Anyway , cmon people. What are your general hot takes? And I’m not talking Dawson belongs with Joey , I have time to kill today.

But I will never forgive him for how he talked to Joey during her prom like all of that was so uncalled for it’s one thing to have insecurities but to blame your girlfriend and say u feel like nothing with her is brutal. U would think he would see her crying and stop but he didn’t then later he didn’t apologize he just broke up with her. I know he apologized later but still fuck him for that.

I'm sorry you can't convince me that Pacey didn't still love Joey in season 5 it was written all over his face even if he was with Audrey. I feel like if Joey told him no when he asked he would've respected that.

So I kept seeing people post on here say that nobody including Pacey cared that Joey got mugged so I watched the next episode last night. Come to find out they did Pacey says they all rallied around her I was over here thinking everybody sucked. 🙄🤣

First off, do you think Dawson and Joey would have ended up together if he hadn't been so obsessed with her and stuck in their childhood dynamic? What if he had just relaxed, dated other people, and explored relationships with girls like Nikki from season 3? And second—hear me out on this one—what if Dawson had Lucas Scott’s personality from One Tree Hill? I know it might sound silly, but I feel like the whole love triangle would have been way more intense and unpredictable if Dawson had that kind of vibe. Don't get me wrong, I’m a total Pacey and Joey shipper, but I always have these "what if" scenarios running through my head, haha. P.S. English isn't my native language, so I hope this all makes sense and you get what I mean!

Season 5 really does it's best to try and make you forget Pacey and Joey were ever a thing. It's like the show rebooted itself or something, or forget it's own continuity for a season. If you skipped seasons 3 and 4, and went from 2 to 5, you wouldn't know any different about Pacey and Joey's relationship, its actually crazy

... he is good in it, however movie drags a lot, nothin special tbh, but for james i will be kind to it and give it 3 out of 5 score

I love Pacey & Joey’s relationship so much more in season 6 than I do in season 4.

So I'm a 37 year old guy. The show was on WB when I was 9-14 but I never watched it (or any other teen shows or movies really) and only knew of it from pop culture references or parodies like Mad TV. In 2006 on WB's last day on the air they showed the pilot eps of all their hit shows. I was 17 and it was the first time I watched Dawson's Creek and I was surprised I actually I liked it because I'm a Latino from the hood so I never thought a show of rich white kids would be my thing lol.

At the same time I loved listening to the radio show Loveline with Dr. Drew and Adam Carolla and they mentioned a few times they had a cameo on the later season and that got me interested in it. I waited until I was around 20 to rent the first couple seasons on DVD from Netflix. Didn't reach Season 3 until bought the DVD at around 27. Then bought season 4 on YouTube and still have never finished it, it got too soap opera-y and had a lot of filler so I think that's why I lost interest.

But so many things happened recently that have made me interested in coming back to finally finish the show. Starting with last year I watched Varsity Blues for the first time and thought it was great. Then the cast had a reunion to raise money for charity. Then James' sad passing. The last couple months I've seen posts of Katie Holmes and Josh Jackson for their upcoming movie. And lastly I got the Katie Holmes movie "GO" on 4K Blu-Ray last week so seeing all this stuff has made me nostalgic for the show. Not sure if I should continue on season 4 or start the show all over. Are the last couple seasons even as good as the first ones?

Was in the middle of rewatching DC with my roommate and it got taken off Crave with no warning 😭 literally right in the middle of the buildup to Pacey and Joey too, so devastating!

Anyone know how else to watch in Canada?

Why is it when Joey got mugged Paycey didn’t care at all but then later when she got with that guy who he thought was stalking her he got all big brother mode again. Where was this energy when she got mugged?

I don't know if an article link is permitted, but Kevin Williamson spoke about James Van der Beek when he accepted the Hero Award at the Barbara Berlanti Gala over the weekend. He said James was the soul of the show and had a full character arc in real life, becoming a good father and husband.

Mary-Margaret Humes and Joshua Jackson also attended.

It's great to see Kevin and the cast stay connected!

https://variety.com/2026/tv/columns/dawsons-creek-kevin-williamson-james-van-der-beek-cancer-1236898546/

I keep seeing this clip in so many edits. It’s Pacey looking all in love and Joey laughing he has a hokey jersey on and his hair is all done up it looks like he is at a party. Any help would be greatly appreciated it’s driving me crazy.

Potentially unpopular opinion, but Joey is an absolutely unlikeable character at this point mid s4. Spoilers ahead.

NOTE: this is just an opinion, so it's okay to disagree, and I would be open to having my mind changed if we can keep it kind :)

I'm doing my first watch because even though I'm a millennial I just didn't watch it because (my younger self was very edgy and would annoy me today) it was too mainstream. Now I'm more than twice the age of the characters and found the show because I've been really sick with the flu, so I decided to give it a shot.

There's a lot to love even when it annoys me. I honestly like how selfish Dawson can be or stupidly characters can react because it feels authentic to what I remember to a teenage experience. I really liked Joey in S1-3 because even when she was obnoxious, it felt like it was immature or defensive in a believable way, and she did show remorse after most of these events.

But Joey Potter is killing me in S4.

Pacey has his flaws, and I get that a lot of their dynamic is disagreeing, but Joey is downright MEAN. ANYTHING happens and she attacks him, condescends to him, and belittles him. Explosively. Like holy hell, do you even LIKE this young man? Pacey never really gives it back at her. And she never seems to apologize for her crummy behavior.

A couple of examples: Pacey is awkward about his current educational status and college aspirations when he's her +1 at the yacht club, and says something about how he's going to Yale. She drags him out to yell at him for lying. Pacey's trying to talk about how she feels about the Dawson / Gretchen kiss and she yells at him for being an annoyance / distraction while she's trying to study. Pacey asks about the recommendation from the person who knows her best, and she says he can't get mad at her for choosing Dawson.

Except, maybe he could? Maybe he should? She's treating him terribly, and he doesn't defend himself (maybe because he doesn't feel like he deserves better).

What's frustrating me is that, while this can be human and teenage reactiveness again, the show keeps trying to sell me this ship. While I don't ship Dawson and Joey, at this point I don't ship Joey and Pacey either, and would love to see the character be with someone who appreciates him instead of blowing hot and cold.

If this was a real relationship, it would be emotionally unsafe and I'd tell someone to run, because there's so much walking on eggshells required.

That's it! Thanks for staying for my take. I just wanted to know if there's anyone else who feels this way, or if anyone can change my mind!

This probably have been said a lot on this sub.Season 5 was underwhelming but Season 6 feels even worse. I just finish 6x7 and it’s really hard to contribute the show.
First of all Audrey is more annoying and unlikable than she was in the previous season and Her singing is horrendous.
Jack story line with his professor is very unnecessary because they literally did this with Joey and her professor the previous season.
Dawson don’t have that much screen time but that’s due to James requesting less screen time because he was tired(so I heard) so Joey is pretty much the main character and her storylines are boring. At this point I wouldn’t mind if Dawson and Natasha are end game.